Gasol on the block Options

[madisonsmadhouse]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...bulls-headlines

Bulls fueling up with Gasol?
He's on the market for Bulls to grab, but they won't give up Gordon, Deng

By Sam Smith
Tribune pro basketball reporter

January 21, 2007, 9:09 PM CST


No, no, no, the Memphis Grizzlies kept protesting a few months ago when it was suggested here that the Bulls had a package of players to trade for Pau Gasol, that Gasol wasn't exactly hurrying back from his broken foot to be with the weak team and that a trade could benefit both teams.

Gasol is untouchable, Grizzlies management insisted.



Or not.

There was a report Sunday in the New York Post that Gasol, surprise, surprise, upset with the direction of the Grizzlies, is asking to be traded and general manager Jerry West is seeking offers.

First, the rumor: Luol Deng and Ben Gordon for Gasol.

Forget it! Not a chance.

Attempts to reach Bulls officials for comment Sunday were unsuccessful. But league sources familiar with the Grizzlies say there hasn't been a specific exchange of names with the Bulls or any trade proposal. But the Bulls, among other teams, have been notified that Gasol is available.

As suggested here two months ago, Gasol would be an ideal fit for the Bulls, just as Kevin Garnett would be. Though different players—Garnett more the defender and worker and Gasol more offensive minded—both are good passers who could provide the power-forward size and scoring the Bulls need to complement Ben Wallace.

The addition of either would make the Bulls the favorite to reach the NBA Finals from the Eastern Conference. Garnett seems unlikely to be traded with the Timberwolves in playoff contention. But the Grizzlies have the league's worst record and sources say Gasol told owner Michael Heisley last week he doesn't have the patience for another rebuilding.

It's great news for the Bulls. But an indication of how difficult making a major deal can be is how this has developed.

The Bulls, despite my advice, had not had any conversations with the Grizzlies regarding Gasol this season.

Then, a few days ago, a third party not connected with the Grizzlies was believed to have contacted the Bulls to say Gasol was available and the Grizzlies would be interested in Deng and Gordon.

Subsequently, sources say West spoke with Bulls general manager John Paxson, but no specific offers or players names were exchanged or sought. It seems likely now Gasol will be traded before the Feb. 22 deadline. One potential complication is the franchise remains for sale and insiders say Heisley is again in talks with a Memphis group of minority owners. It's not clear whether the new group would want to retain Gasol if a sale is consummated.

One factor in the Bulls' favor is Gasol is represented by Arn Tellem, who is close with the Bulls and last summer did the Ben Wallace deal. Tellem supposedly has talked for some time about getting Gasol into a better market.

Interestingly, Gasol's younger brother Marc, a 7-footer playing in Spain, will be in this draft and is expected to be a first-round selection.

Gasol is averaging 19.3 points, 7 rebounds and 2.5 assists this season and 21.7 points and 9.4 rebounds this month after making the All-Star team last season and then suffering a broken foot in the world championships last summer.

However desirable Gasol might be, Gordon and Deng appear to be off the table.

The Bulls would need Gordon's outside shooting to spread the floor and keep double teams off Gasol. Gasol has struggled when teams could collapse on him as they have with poor talent around him. Likewise, it would be questionable for the Bulls to trade Deng because he moves so well off the ball and Gasol is an excellent passer.

NBA rules limit trading the draft pick the Bulls could get from the Knicks, which could complicate a deal. Figure the Bulls would trade Tyrus Thomas, because Gasol would take minutes from him, and probably Andres Nocioni. Would that be enough for the Grizzlies, with future first-rounders thrown in? Probably not.

The Grizzlies probably also would ask for Kirk Hinrich, who seemingly would be a good fit because the Grizzlies desperately need a point guard. Dealing Hinrich is somewhat complicated because of his contract extension, but it is possible with at least a half-dozen players also in a deal to make salary-cap issues work.

Certainly, the Bulls want to keep Hinrich, but they are loaded at guard and have Thabo Sefolosha in the wings—unless the Grizzlies want him.

Figure these talks may take awhile, though, yes, they finally are talking seriously.



Copyright © 2007, The Chicago Tribune

[Steve9347]

I think it's the fact that Kirk doesn't have a definite role in the NBA. He's not a shooting guard, because he doesn't shoot well enough, and he's not a point guard, because he doesn't protect the ball and get enough assists... he's a 2-guard when this team is looking for him to be a point guard.

On a side note, an interesting part of Mike McGraw's column in todays Daily Herald

One side note about Hinrich: It’s been written many places, including here, that he’s difficult to trade right now because of signing a contract extension just before the start of the season.

Not true. There are special salary-cap rules for players who sign extensions, but in the latest collective-bargaining agreement, salaries only have to match within 25 percent, instead of the previous 15 percent, for trades to work.

So a theoretical trade sending Hinrich, P.J. Brown and Andre Barrett to Memphis for Gasol and guard Dahntay Jones would be allowed.

[ZoomSlowik]

I think it's the fact that Kirk doesn't have a definite role in the NBA. He's not a shooting guard, because he doesn't shoot well enough, and he's not a point guard, because he doesn't protect the ball and get enough assists... he's a 2-guard when this team is looking for him to be a point guard.

I don't see how you could say that, he's averaging 2.3 turnovers per game, less than Gordon and and only .3 more than Noc and .5 more than Deng, and he's also posting 6.3 assists right now. There are only 16 players in the league averaging over 6 assists per game, and 5 of them aren't even point guards, they're scorers that have the ball in their hands basically the entire game (Wade, Lebron, Arenas, McGrady and Iverson). Of those 16 players only Chauncey Billups has fewer turnovers per game, and only 6 of them average under 3 turnovers per game. He's also 20th in the NBA in assist/turnover ratio, and half of the guys ahead of him get less than 30 minutes per game. Kirk's not spectacular, but he's very efficient, and he provides more scoring punch than a number of these guys, and plays pretty solid defense at the point. There are really only 6 or 7 point guards that are definitively better than Kirk.

[eddog2]

I don't see how you could say that, he's averaging 2.3 turnovers per game, less than Gordon and and only .3 more than Noc and .5 more than Deng, and he's also posting 6.3 assists right now. There are only 16 players in the league averaging over 6 assists per game, and 5 of them aren't even point guards, they're scorers that have the ball in their hands basically the entire game (Wade, Lebron, Arenas, McGrady and Iverson). Of those 16 players only Chauncey Billups has fewer turnovers per game, and only 6 of them average under 3 turnovers per game. He's also 20th in the NBA in assist/turnover ratio, and half of the guys ahead of him get less than 30 minutes per game. Kirk's not spectacular, but he's very efficient, and he provides more scoring punch than a number of these guys, and plays pretty solid defense at the point. There are really only 6 or 7 point guards that are definitively better than Kirk.

Defense or not if we get Gasol we need Gordon more than Hinrich. Gasol and Wallace would be defensive stoppers down low. Thabo can take over the defensive responsibilities that Kirk previously had. I still would like to get another point guard in the deal. A "true" pg. Someone who passes and creates shots for others. Unlike Kirk.

As for the turnovers and assist comparison, T-mac, & Wade don't have the ball in their hand all the time. Last time I checked, Jason Williams/Payton & Rafer Alston are the ones with the ball bringing it upcourt. However, unlike Kirk, T-Mac & Wade are offensive forces. They get doubled teamed alot. However, they know how to distribute the ball to the right people at the right time when the double team comes. That's something Kirk doesn't command and it's something he's not good at.

All I'm saying is that Kirk signed for too much money. If we get Gasol we are more likely to win it all with Gordon/Gasol/Deng on offense then we are with Hinrich/Gasol/Deng on offense. Defensively we will be fine b/c we would have Gasol/Wallace to clog up the middle and we still have defensive players like Thabo/Griffin. Deng and Gordon's extensions don't go on the books until 2008/09. So we could be back to back champs by then. Keeping Kirk, Nocioni & Deng means that we won't have enough to resign Deng when the time comes.

If we keep Gordon we will have enough to resign at least Deng and most likely both. We can also unload Wallace in the final 2 years of his contract if there are any takers. That will free up more money to resign Deng & Ben. When a team is favored to win the championship they often are able to sign key veterans and top players to 1 year minimum contracts as those players try and win a title. That's what the Bulls would be able to do.

Although I don't necessarily love Duhon, he is a fundamental point guard. If we trade Kirk and don't get a starting PG in return we still have Duhon who is capable of distributing the ball. With Deng/Gordon/Gasol that's all i'd want my PG to do anyway.

[ZoomSlowik]

Defense or not if we get Gasol we need Gordon more than Hinrich. Gasol and Wallace would be defensive stoppers down low. Thabo can take over the defensive responsibilities that Kirk previously had. I still would like to get another point guard in the deal. A "true" pg. Someone who passes and creates shots for others. Unlike Kirk.

As for the turnovers and assist comparison, T-mac, & Wade don't have the ball in their hand all the time. Last time I checked, Jason Williams/Payton & Rafer Alston are the ones with the ball bringing it upcourt. However, unlike Kirk, T-Mac & Wade are offensive forces. They get doubled teamed alot. However, they know how to distribute the ball to the right people at the right time when the double team comes. That's something Kirk doesn't command and it's something he's not good at.

All I'm saying is that Kirk signed for too much money. If we get Gasol we are more likely to win it all with Gordon/Gasol/Deng on offense then we are with Hinrich/Gasol/Deng on offense. Defensively we will be fine b/c we would have Gasol/Wallace to clog up the middle and we still have defensive players like Thabo/Griffin. Deng and Gordon's extensions don't go on the books until 2008/09. So we could be back to back champs by then. Keeping Kirk, Nocioni & Deng means that we won't have enough to resign Deng when the time comes.

If we keep Gordon we will have enough to resign at least Deng and most likely both. We can also unload Wallace in the final 2 years of his contract if there are any takers. That will free up more money to resign Deng & Ben. When a team is favored to win the championship they often are able to sign key veterans and top players to 1 year minimum contracts as those players try and win a title. That's what the Bulls would be able to do.

Although I don't necessarily love Duhon, he is a fundamental point guard. If we trade Kirk and don't get a starting PG in return we still have Duhon who is capable of distributing the ball. With Deng/Gordon/Gasol that's all i'd want my PG to do anyway.

Are you really trying to argue that their respective offenses don't run through guys like Wade, T-Mac, Lebron, Arenas and Iverson? Cause that's a rather ludicrous argument. It's not really possible to take as many shots as those guys do without being the focal point of the offense. So I guess by that logic the Bulls offense revolved around BJ Armstrong and not Michael back in the day? Come on now. Just because they have another player that can handle the ball doesn't mean that they they aren't the principle focus of the offense and have the ball in their hands for a good chunk of the game.

I don't really see how the creating shots for others/double teams point really matters in this situation since Gordon doesn't do that either. We don't have someone like those players, so I don't see what the point in arguing that is. How many PG's consistently draw a double team? There aren't many, and their teams aren't likely to give them up. Even with guys like Nash and Kidd it doesn't happen all that much (unless he's mid-drive) because of the other threats they have on the team.

That whole salary point isn't true at all. There's no real cap in basketball, so there's nothing stopping them from keeping Deng as well. Hell, Jordan alone used to make more money than most teams, that didn't stop us from keeping Pippen. The Knicks are paying $19 mil a year for Marbury, $14 mil for Francis, $10 mil for Curry, almost $8 mil for Crawford, over $7 mil for Richardson, and $6 mil each for Rose, James, and Jeffries (that's $76 mil to 8 guys, which at a similar ratio would leave us about $40 mil for Deng, Gordon, and Noc, with the max any of them would get probably around $12 mil. Hell, even Lebron and Wade didn't crack $16 per year). It'd put us into luxary tax range, but that can't really be avoided if we plan on keeping our young players long term, regardless of whether we trade for Gasol or not. Plus given the potential market it's not like Gordon is going to be any cheaper in two years, and Wallace would be off the books in 3 years.

No key veteran worth a damn is going to sign a one-year deal when someone else is offering them more elsewhere. The only guys you'll get in that situation are guys like Payton and Malone that are past their prime and desperate for a ring.

The problem with having Duhon at the point in that situation is that teams would sag off of him and pay more attention to Gasol and Deng and would also have another guy that could close out on Gordon, and that issue would be even more compounded with Ben Wallace around for the next few years. You need a PG that is at least a threat to hit the open jumper on a regular basis, something Duhon simply can't do. Playing 3-on-5 on the offensive end is something you just can't do, we'd really need to find another PG if we were to deal Hinrich. That's not typically an easy thing to do, unless you want to overpay for someone like Speedy Claxton or Derek Fisher in free agency.

Gordon would be a nice guy to have around once we have a true post threat, but the same is true for Hinrich. Both are probably better fits with Gasol than Deng since the latter is a heavy mid-range/slashing guy, but Deng also is a solid all-around player with a high ceiling that you'd hate to lose. Honestly, I think the type of deal I'd prefer most is something like Tyrus, Noc and Brown, but I wouldn't exactly be all torn up if Gordon was the one that had to go, and Memphis looks like they need a guard more than forwards since they already have Gay, Warrick, and Miller to play those spots (Miller can probably play the 2 in a pinch, but has mostly been a SF).