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> Rumor: Chandler to the Hornets
dasox24
post Jul 2 2006, 11:00 PM
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QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Jul 2 2006, 10:28 PM)
It took O'Neal 4 season to get it together. After his 4th season in Portland, he was traded to Indiana. Tyson is entering his 6th season. And that is a bad comparison, considering Jermaine has an offensive game.

Well, maybe I don't remember much about Jermaine when he was in Portland, so I don't know what his "game" consisted of... although how could you either when he only averaged 11.4 minutes/game in his first 4 seasons.

And don't try to spin it by using terms like 4th year and 6th year. You try to make Chandler sound worse by saying "Tyson is entering his 6th season" and O'Neal sound better by using "4th season" in describing him. That makes it sound like Tyson has taken two years longer to contribute, whereas if he were to make a big time impact this year, it would only be one year after O'Neal made his first signifant impact.

So, while Chandler has had more overall PT during his first few years in the NBA, he's also had a back injury to deal with (which basically took a year out of his development), stupid advice from his agent (to not work out over summer while trying to get a big contract, which basically made the first half of this year a wash), and other little things that have stunted his growth.

However, now he has no choice but to produce. There are no more excuses for him to make. He's out of them.


BTW, I'm kinda just playing devil's advocate here b/c if we did make the Hornets trade, and then spun Brown to Detroit in a sign and trade for Wallace, followed by a signing of, let's say, Drew Gooden, I'd absolutely love that. I'm just trying to stick up for Tyson b/c I do like him.
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SoxFan1
post Jul 2 2006, 11:14 PM
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QUOTE (dasox24 @ Jul 2 2006, 11:53 PM)
Well, maybe I don't remember much about Jermaine when he was in Portland, so I don't know what his "game" consisted of... although how could you either when he only averaged 11.4 minutes/game in his first 4 seasons.

And don't try to spin it by using terms like 4th year and 6th year. You try to make Chandler sound worse by saying "Tyson is entering his 6th season" and O'Neal sound better by using "4th season" in describing him. That makes it sound like Tyson has taken two years longer to contribute, whereas if he were to make a big time impact this year, it would only be one year after O'Neal made his first signifant impact.

So, while Chandler has had more overall PT during his first few years in the NBA, he's also had a back injury to deal with (which basically took a year out of his development), stupid advice from his agent (to not work out over summer while trying to get a big contract, which basically made the first half of this year a wash), and other little things that have stunted his growth.

However, now he has no choice but to produce. There are no more excuses for him to make. He's out of them.


Also, I'm kinda just playing devil's advocate here b/c if we did make the Hornets trade, and then spun Brown to Detroit in a sign and trade for Wallace, followed by a signing of, let's say, Drew Gooden, I'd absolutely love that. I'm just trying to stick up for Tyson b/c I do like him.

Of course, how could I remember the Bulls trying everything to land the guy who averaged 3 points in 11 minutes.... rolleyes.gif

And I have no clue what you mean with the 4th season/6th season thing. Am I wrong? No. In O'Neals 5th season, he finally got PT in Indiana and blossomed. Tyson Chandler has received ample PT in 5 season with the Bulls and has yet to do much.

Jermaine O'Neal ALWAYS has good low post moves. His mental immaturity and selfishness held him back on the Blazers. And don't act like Jermaine O'Neal never had any troubles either. We give Tyson all the excuses..."he got bad advice from his agent"..."he was injured"...give me a break. O'Neal only played 36 games in 98/99 and got 9 mpg. The next season, 12 mpg. Chandler never got less than 19.6 mpg in his career and hes yet to amount to anything. In 4 years, O'Neal started 18 TOTAL games with Portland. Chandler started 31 his rookie year. The only thing I give credit to Chandler for is being a good rebounder. Le

The comparisons are pointless and so is the hope. Brand for Chandler = worst deal in Bulls history.
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dasox24
post Jul 2 2006, 11:45 PM
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QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Jul 2 2006, 11:07 PM)
Brand for Chandler = worst deal in Bulls history

That is something I can definitely agree with.


Oh, and the whole 4th/6th year thing got a little complicated, but I just wanted to point out that it's possible Chandler could still show more than he has. Basically, they would only be 1 year apart in "breakout" years.
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soxfan101
post Jul 3 2006, 12:18 AM
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Yeah the O'Neal CHandler thing shows nothing considering Chandler always got playing time here where O'Neal was blocked in Portland and basicly contributed as soon as he got playing time.
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HardWorkin'H...
post Jul 3 2006, 01:11 AM
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Chandler also needs to seriously show up like 30lbs heavier this season. But I just dont think he has the type of body like that. His metabolism must be lightning quick.
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Chisoxfn
post Jul 3 2006, 01:47 AM
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QUOTE (dasox24 @ Jul 2 2006, 08:22 PM)
I really want to give Chandler another year to try to prove something unless we get rid of him for KG. Otherwise, I want to see how he does this year.


Btw, didn't Jermaine O'Neal take 5-6 years until he actually did something worth noting in the league? Now look at what kind of player he is. Who knows if Chandler will ever amount to that (probably not), but there's always that chance. And, it's a chance I'm willing to take.

Also, for those of you worried about how much Tyson gets called for fouls, I don't think he'd have to worry as much with a guy like Ben Wallace playing next to him. He'd be much more free to roam around w/ Ben as our first line of defense and Chandler coming over to help, rather than Chandler having to be that guy who has to make the initial contact. We all know Wallace gets away with a lot of calls, and I think Chandler would benefit from having him be the guy that goes after anyone attacking the rim, which would allow Chandler to come over to help and get more blocks.

But in O'Neals case, he wasn't really getting minutes in Portland so that really limited his growth. Portland was a top team competing for titles with the Lakers and really had no place for the young Jermaine O'Neal. He got some minutes, but he didn't get near the experience and playing time that Chandler has gotten.
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Chisoxfn
post Jul 3 2006, 01:49 AM
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QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Jul 2 2006, 09:07 PM)
Of course, how could I remember the Bulls trying everything to land the guy who averaged 3 points in 11 minutes.... rolleyes.gif

And I have no clue what you mean with the 4th season/6th season thing. Am I wrong? No. In O'Neals 5th season, he finally got PT in Indiana and blossomed. Tyson Chandler has received ample PT in 5 season with the Bulls and has yet to do much.

Jermaine O'Neal ALWAYS has good low post moves. His mental immaturity and selfishness held him back on the Blazers. And don't act like Jermaine O'Neal never had any troubles either. We give Tyson all the excuses..."he got bad advice from his agent"..."he was injured"...give me a break. O'Neal only played 36 games in 98/99 and got 9 mpg. The next season, 12 mpg. Chandler never got less than 19.6 mpg in his career and hes yet to amount to anything. In 4 years, O'Neal started 18 TOTAL games with Portland. Chandler started 31 his rookie year. The only thing I give credit to Chandler for is being a good rebounder. Le

The comparisons are pointless and so is the hope. Brand for Chandler = worst deal in Bulls history.

When the Bulls wanted to get O'Neal, he was flashing a few signs but I dont' think anyone really expected him to turn into the player he did today. There was just as much of a shot of him totally bellying up like when the Lakers acquired Kwame Brown from the Wizards.

O'Neal didn't emerge till he joined the Pacers and was really able to play (although I vaguely remember him starting to show some sort of game late in his final season with the Blazers, but he really rarely played).
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madisonsmadhouse
post Jul 3 2006, 09:13 AM
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I don't know if this is a domino type of deal, but in a vaccuum it sucks.
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BuLLzDoMaIn
post Jul 3 2006, 09:41 AM
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IF chandler gains alot of pounds i think we should wait to see what he does. but if he shows up the same....... I think its time for him to go.
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ChWRoCk2
post Jul 3 2006, 11:43 AM
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QUOTE (BuLLzDoMaIn @ Jul 3 2006, 11:34 AM)
IF chandler gains alot of pounds i think we should wait to see what he does. but if he shows up the same....... I think its time for him to go.

If you get Big Ben he should go, Wallace will play the majority of the game with Sweets behind him. Id love to see Tyson and Wallace on D, something tells me they could click but PJ Brown scores more points even though he only averages about 9 a game.

Only problem I have with this is that PJ Brown is in his thirtys and if were gonna have him for a year or two might as well just call the deal off, the thing in this trade that wins me over is JR Smith, he can be an absolute stud on our team. And I like to watch his dunks. smile.gif

This trade can go either way, something tells me Pax is throwin Tysons name in the air to see if he can catch a breeze of interest.
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SoxFan1
post Jul 3 2006, 12:34 PM
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QUOTE (ChWRoCk2 @ Jul 3 2006, 12:36 PM)
Only problem I have with this is that PJ Brown is in his thirtys and if were gonna have him for a year or two might as well just call the deal off, the thing in this trade that wins me over is JR Smith, he can be an absolute stud on our team. And I like to watch his dunks. smile.gif

I think you're looking at this deal totally in the wrong way. Brown is a proven PF/C at the NBA level. He is a leader and he has skill. He is Antonio Davis, but a better player. He can definitely score, he's averaged over 10 ppg in quite a few season in hiis career, but he was never a #1 option, so hit totals aren't as high as they could be. He is polished down low, and with his veteran leadership and knowledge of the game, he could help out or young guys down low in Thomas and Sweetney. He want to win a title and he'll do whatever he is asked to do...thats always been a staple with Brown. He's a good guy and a good player. And,we would only have him for 1 year (9 mil), which would save us some cap room in the future to resign Kirk, Luol, Noc, and Ben. This trade makes complete sense for the Bulls. It makes even more sense if Big Ben comes to Chicago.

Looking at JR Smith, he has a lot of talent and athletic ability, but he won't receive to much playing time in Chicago. That's what he complained about in NO, and if h was here, he'd complain about it again. BUT....Scott Skiles is the type of coach who could straighten a guy like that out and bring the best out of him.

Honestly, I have no clue what could happen. I can only hope that Ben Wallace signs with the Bulls and that this trade goes down. If it does, I wouldn't be surprised to see another deal involving Brown and/or Smith.
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Clifton Pondexte...
post Jul 3 2006, 12:39 PM
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Get rid of Chandler now. The guy has back issues at 23. They haven't invented a game short enough for him not to be in foul trouble. He can't score down low. He's a great defender and decent rebounder, but that said, game after game how many times does he have more fouls than points and snags about 5 rebounds? That's not worth the money on his contract. Let some other team wait for him to play up to his potential, and free up some cap space for basketball players not projects.
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allbullz
post Jul 3 2006, 12:53 PM
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I'd applaud any deal that trades Chandler and that undeserved contract away from here. The kid does have a great attitude and can rebound and block a little but NOTHING else. He can't shoot from the perimeter, can't shoot free throws, has no low post moves of any kind, can't finish at the basket whether it's on a fast break or off an offensive rebound and gets into foul trouble early and often. Why that's worth keeping, I have no idea.
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SoxFan1
post Jul 3 2006, 01:04 PM
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Welcome aboard to the both of you! cheers.gif
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Chisoxfn
post Jul 3 2006, 01:22 PM
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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 3 2006, 07:06 AM)
I don't know if this is a domino type of deal, but in a vaccuum it sucks.

The talk is that the Bulls either do that after getting Big Ben cause they get more scoring or this is part of a sign and trade with Brown (and possibly Smith) both going to Detroit for Wallace.

We get Wallace and than still have pretty much a max contract left to hand out this year (or we could divide that up to two other people) and add two more players to go with Ben.

People like Pyrzbilla, Harrington, Gooden, Nazr, etc.

Think of it this way, what if:
Detroit gets: Jr Smith and PJ Brown (expiring contract Detroit wants)
New Orleans gets: Tyson Chandler and Malik Allen
Bulls get: Ben Wallace (4yr 13 or 14 mill; but counting 12 mill against the cap this year)

Bulls than have about 12 mill left in FA and offer up about 6 mill (just over the exemption) for Pyrzbilla per year and than about that same amount for Drew Gooden.

Drew Gooden, Joel Pyrzbilla, and Ben Wallace = major upgrade over Tyson Chandler, Malik Allen and Darius Songalia
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