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TalkBulls Forums _ Bulls Talk _ Offseason: Draft, Needs, FAs, Trades
Posted by: ChWRoCk2 May 3 2009, 09:50 AM
Thought we could use a thread strictly for discussing the offseason. It will be a long one.
We have two first round picks this year. #16 and #26
Do we try to trade up? Draft players from both spots.
Save our money for 2010? Possibly go after say Boozer or Jermaine ONeal?
Just things to discuss and think about it.
I'd love to get Terrence Williams and DeJuan Blair. Doubtful we could get both though unless one falls.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 3 2009, 12:21 PM
Kirk and/or Luol and/or Tyrus will be traded.
I would really hate to see Tyrus go... he has so much potential and, judging by how much he improved with his jumpshot this season and communicating with the team better, he's made a serious commitment to improving as a player. I have no idea why he's always on the bench.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 3 2009, 12:33 PM
We have two first round picks this year. #16 and #26
Do we try to trade up? Draft players from both spots.
Save our money for 2010? Possibly go after say Boozer or Jermaine ONeal?
Just things to discuss and think about it.
I'd love to get Terrence Williams and DeJuan Blair. Doubtful we could get both though unless one falls.
Boozer is a FA this offseason. He will likely wind up with Detroit barring someone pulling off a miracle and finding more cap space, although a sign and trade could be possible if we could interest Utah in about $15 million worth of our current contracts. Jermaine O'Neal is not even close to a FA: he'd have to opt out of something like $20+ million for next season. He'll make more next year by not opting out than he would in his next 5.
The Bulls have no cap space this offseason to speak of. They could use the MLE for 1 season if they lose out on Gordon. In 2010, they're currently a couple million away from being able to offer a true max deal.
Trying to trade up would be an intelligent move if anyone wanted it...but it's a wide open offseason right now. We can survive without making changes for once. But some changes would be darn nice, and we're in a great position to make them.
Posted by: GreatScott82 May 3 2009, 12:49 PM
Well first off i would like to say that series with Boston was amazing. I never thought we would be that close. The reason i say that is- this team just doesn't play defense. . in game 7 we saw that as we gave up too many easy layups. With that being said i would say objective #1 is to either get a new head coach who stresses defense OR get a defensive specialist assistant to add to the coaching staff.
Objective #2 - I hate to say this but were better off just letting Gordon walk. Save that money for 2010 as guys like Bosh, Nowitski, Wade and Stoudemire will be available.
Objective #3- Make a deal. I would offer Toronto Brad Miller and Tyrus Thomas for Chris Bosh. I would have said Noah, but it seems as if Noah has more basketball smarts than Thomas and Im sure Toronto would want a guy as athletic as Thomas if they are giving up there best player.
Objective #4- Draft an athletic guard to come off the bench to back up Rose. I would love if Stephen Curry would still be available at #16. Draft another big guy to come off the bench. BJ Mullens would be a great pick up. Hopefully he falls to 26- i highly doubt it, but you never know..
Your 2009-2010 chicago bulls:
Joakim Noah C
Chris Bosh PF
Luol Deng SF
John Salmons SG
Derek Rose
Bench:
Hinrich PG-SG,
Stephen Curry PG
Tim Thomas SF-PF,
BJ Mullens PF-C
Aaron Gray C (re-sign him to a cheap 1 year deal)
Lindsey Hunter G (re-sign him to a cheap 1 year deal- the dude is great as Rose's mentor)
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 3 2009, 12:58 PM
Trade Kirk, Tyrus, filler and our 2 First rounders for Amare. Then resign BG. A lineup of Rose,BG,Deng,Amare,Noah would be EC contenders. If that fails I'm pretty sure Kirk is going to be traded but I'm not so sure about expirings anymore. Our team darn near got to the 2nd round when we were expecting to barely give the C's a series. We need to restock on some good players. I'm a fan of Travis Outlaw and to me Kirk in Portland makes sense.
Posted by: GreatScott82 May 3 2009, 01:21 PM
The only way we re-sign BG is if we trade Hinrich. In that case your sacrificing solid defense and hustle for an inconsistent scoring machine. . . Would that be worth it? I guess in VDN's basketball world it would be. I would like Amare, but his injuries scare me. Bosh is a sure 20-10 every night.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 3 2009, 02:46 PM
I would vastly prefer BG to Hinrich.
And I'd vastly prefer Bosh to Amare. If you allow me to factor in their contract status, and you assume the coach will play them equal minutes, I pretty much value Tyrus and Amare the same right now, given age, injuries, defense, the Suns offense, and how much more expensive Amare is going to be for the next 6 years. You can laugh at me for that if you want.
Posted by: Bullerwinkle May 3 2009, 03:02 PM
As I see it Tyrus Thomas has made excellent strides and will stay. He will either start or be 6th man but for the Bulls to trade him now would be a mistake.
I hate to see Hinrich go but it appears that may gonna happen. He can start at PG or SG for too many teams. If Gordon stays the Bulls are looking good
I'm not so sure you go for Bosch with 2 first round picks. With Noah and Miller in the middle the Bulls are set.
Aaron Gray can play but doesn't fit with the Bulls up tempo so he's gone as is Tim Thomas and Lindsey Hunter.
I think your starting 5 will be what it is now next year: Rose, Gordon, Thomas, Noah, and Deng. Salmons is the 6th man
If Hinrich goes you need another guard and you need another PF. As I see it, you don't mess too much with the chemistry. If you can get Amare I favor him over Bosch.
Gotta watch the cap too folks....these are some salaries for those who will/may be here next year:
* Brad Miller - $12,250,000
*Kirk Hinrich - $9,500,000
*Luol Deng - $10,370,425
*John Salmons - $5,456,000
* Derrick Rose - $5,184,480
*Tyrus Thomas - $4,743,598
*Joakim Noah - $2,455,680
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 3 2009, 04:29 PM
The way I see it, one of the following two things has to happen for the Bulls to make any kind of progress next year:
1) Acquire a big man that can actually create their own shot
2) Retain Gordon
If one of those two doesn't happen, their offense, and in effect the team as a whole since they're not a good defensive/rebounding team, is screwed. The lineup works reasonably well right now because Rose, Gordon and Salmons are all capable of going off at times, but replace Gordon with Deng in the starting lineup and you have problems. We've seen what happens when Deng, Tyrus, Noah and Salmons when he's not hot try to create shots, and it isn't pretty.
In an ideal world you trade anyone not named Rose for Bosh and re-sign Gordon, giving you a pretty nasty scoring trio. The defense would be a bit soft, but they're not exactly shutting people down anyways and Bosh can at least rebound. I'd take Stoudemire too, but I'd prefer Bosh mostly for effort/consistency issues, though age, contract and injury issues all lean a bit in his favor too (Amare has the big microfracture injury and the fractured orbital bone, but Bosh tends to get more minor ones that force him to miss about 10 games). Obviously depending on trade scenarios and Gordon's demands we may have to settle for well less than that.
As for the draft, this class BLOWS. Getting someone useful with either of those picks would be a serious longshot. Someone like Jordan Hill would normally go in the late lottery/mid-first and he's a likely top-5 pick. There are some guys I like (DeRozan, James Johnson, Henderson and Patterson), though none are more than role players. Taking a project like Mullens and Holliday might not be an awful idea.
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 3 2009, 05:25 PM
Terrance Williams and Dujuan Blair are my two choices in the draft. I think those guys would fit good on our team because of their versatility and defense.
Posted by: JDsDirtySox May 3 2009, 07:32 PM
As much as it pains me to say it... I think we have to let BG7 walk.
He is lookig to get a big pay day, and I don't want to give him what I think other teams will.
If he could be had for 9... I would do it, but he turned down 11, and there are talks that he is looking for 12 to 15.
I would rather roll with a lineup of Rose, Salmons, Deng, a Stud Big Currently not on the team, and Noah.
If I had my choice, I want to keep Kirk to have as the 6th man off the bench. Kirk is the heart of this team IMO.
He isn't Chauncey Billups, but I think he is that type of important to our team.
that means we have 2 first rounders, Tyrus Thomas, and Brad Miller (and his huge contract) as trading chips.
If I had my choice... I want Bosh.
If he can't be had in a trade... don't panic and make a move just to make a move.
Wait for 2010 and land him then.
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 3 2009, 08:35 PM
Well if there was one player to pay last year if you had to decide between Deng or Gordon I would have said Gordon. We signed the wrong dude. Gordon will be better than anything we can possibly get next year, we HAVE to resign him or look for a sign and trade to get a star player in return.
Posted by: GreatScott82 May 3 2009, 08:55 PM
He is lookig to get a big pay day, and I don't want to give him what I think other teams will.
If he could be had for 9... I would do it, but he turned down 11, and there are talks that he is looking for 12 to 15.
I would rather roll with a lineup of Rose, Salmons, Deng, a Stud Big Currently not on the team, and Noah.
If I had my choice, I want to keep Kirk to have as the 6th man off the bench. Kirk is the heart of this team IMO.
He isn't Chauncey Billups, but I think he is that type of important to our team.
that means we have 2 first rounders, Tyrus Thomas, and Brad Miller (and his huge contract) as trading chips.
If I had my choice... I want Bosh.
If he can't be had in a trade... don't panic and make a move just to make a move.
Wait for 2010 and land him then.
Awesome post and my thoughts exactly. Make a push for Bosh! He would be much more valuable than Stoudemire. I think Brad Miller and Tyrus Thomas with a first rounder should be more than enough for Bosh. If not, he is a free agent in 2010 with the rest of the star studed free agents. I don't want Pax to make the mistake of giving Gordon a big deal and holding us hostage into not being able to make splash to significantly improve our team in the summer of 2010.
Posted by: rockren May 3 2009, 11:10 PM
It looks like this thread has hit exactly what Bulls management is going to try to do...make a run at Bosh.
Tyrus, Miller and the two 1st Rounders will be offered to the Raps before the draft for Bosh IMO. After Colangelo sat down with Bosh a few weeks ago, the first thing Colangelo said to the media was, "We're not trading Bosh." That just goes to show Colagnelo's meeting with Bosh actually went...not well for Toronto. Colangelo will look to build around Bargnani from here on out. Putting Tyrus next to him would match better with Barganani than Bosh did anyway. Not that Tyrus is half the player Bosh is, but Tyrus wouldn't take the low block away from Bargnani like Bosh does. Tyrus playing with a big man in the post would help maximize his potential as well...he'd be great next to Bargnani.
The Raps would get the cap relief from Miller they would've gotten from Bosh anyway while picking up 2 1st Rounders and a RESTRICTED Tyrus Thomas. The Raps would be crazy not to pull the trigger...but they may put the pressure on themselves to let Bosh walk for nothing before the 2010 season...which he'll do.
As for Gordon is concerned. Let him go. The Bulls don't currently have the roster to facilitate him in maximizing his potential. Gordon needs to play with a team that has players who demand multiple double teams. The Bulls don't have one. A team that will creep into the Gordon sweeps (if there are any sweeps for what he actually wants) will be Portland. It has been no secret Portland has been eyeing Gordon for years and have all of the sudden been rumored to have wanted to clear cap space to go after a FA. It may take as much as 5/65 to bring in Gordon. Only a rich owner like Paul Allen may be able to stomach that kind of money for Gordon...but Gordon could reach is max potential in Portland next to Roy. If you watched that Houston series...Portland's best long range shooter was Travis Outlaw. Portland has an embarrassment of riches, which would make a sign and trade deal easy.
Gordon for Outlaw, Webster and Rodriguez. Webster would serve as Gordon's long term solution and is a much better fit to Rose being a 6'6'' G who can shoot from anywhere. Outlaw and Rodriguez contracts would be off the books after '09, but would provide depth and energy for next season. If Portland were interested in adding Gordon to their young/crazy talented roster at 13mil for the next 5 years...they'd make this move. If the Bulls couldn't facilitate a sign/trade deal like this for BG...let him walk for nothing.
A deal that I believe MUST happen...trade Hinrich. I don't care what for. Trade him to Milwaukee for Ridnour and Elson. Both of their contracts are off the books for the 2010 season and would save the Bulls 17 million for the 2010/2011 seasons on a guy who is no more than a backup on our team. Elson can give 10-15 quality minutes a game for any NBA club.
My ideal roster for 2009/2010...it'll never happen:
Rose, Salmons/Webster, Deng, Bosh, Noah....Rodriguez, Salmons/Webster, Outlaw, Elson, Ridnour, Tim Thomas, Jerome James
Posted by: dasox24 May 4 2009, 01:05 AM
If Pax doesn't think we can move any of our bigger contracts (e.g. Hinrich) this off-season, I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the Bulls sold one of their draft picks (or traded for a future pick) to keep money off the books for 2010.
I really hope they make a run at Bosh this off-season, though I doubt anything will happen. We'll probably have to wait until the trade deadline next year to get some action. I just think Toronto will want to hold on to him as long as possible in hopes of either working out a new deal with him or getting more in a trade for him.
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 4 2009, 07:39 AM
Bargnani isn't a traditional low post big man at all, he's more like a small forward masquerading as a big man. 30% of his shots were 3's, and another 44% were 2-point jumpers. Chris Paul had a higher percentage of his shots come in the paint. He's more like a young Nowitzki than anything, which kind of hurts that theory.
That said, Tyrus gives them a far more defense-oriented player at the power forward spot (I'm assuming Marion isn't back), so he could blend a bit better with Bargnani than Bosh since the latter gives them another big that gets a large percentage of his shots on jumpers. They'd need someone else to replace Bosh' scoring though, guys like Calderon and Parker can't really take over with their scoring.
Posted by: Bullerwinkle May 4 2009, 07:56 AM
Look at the money folks! You don't wanna break the bank here!
*Tyrus Thomas is a S*T*E*A*L at $4.75 mil and only has an upside. Miller is the expendable one if you wanna talk money at $12.2 mil. Miller may be hard to move though, He made around 22 turnovers in the series and he's slow.
As I've thought about things, I'm not sure the Bulls can sign Gordon. If that holds true you keep Hinrich who's also a steal at $9.5 mil next year and he's a better defender than Gordon.
I don't see moving Luol Deng. I believe these guys are most likely gone: Tim Thomas, Gordon, and Aaron Gray. I'm not sure what happens after that.
This is what I anticipate to be the roster now if I'm Pax:
- Noah, Deng, Tyrus Thomas, Rose, and Hinrich. Those are your starters with Salmons as sixth man. You have2 first round picks so you don't need to go crazy.
Looking at salariesIf you can get Bosh at $15.8 mil in 2010 that's good,. Stoudamire is due $16.3 mil and with his injuries that's not good so I change my mind and go with Bosh *if* the Raptor wanna deal.
Anyway you gotta watch the money.
The Bulls overall salaries are here:
http://hoopshype.com/salaries/chicago.htm
Posted by: Sanitarium May 4 2009, 08:09 AM
Why not start salmons at the 2?
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 4 2009, 08:17 AM
*Tyrus Thomas is a S*T*E*A*L at $4.75 mil and only has an upside. Miller is the expendable one if you wanna talk money at $12.2 mil. Miller may be hard to move though, He made around 22 turnovers in the series and he's slow.
Miller's contract expires at the end of teh 2009-2010 season. That makes him ridiculously valuable right now.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 4 2009, 09:23 AM
So you're saying a sign and trade involving Gordon as well?
Anyway...the Raps at this point must have some idea whether or not they're keeping Bosh at the end of 2010 given their salary constraints and Bosh's demands. If they think there's a good chance they're keeping him, then nothing will happen. If they don't, put together our best offer now and see if they make the move. If they want more than Tyrus + one of Hinrich/Deng/Gordon/some of our expiring deals in a sign and trade + a couple draft picks, then let them see if someone else can beat that...because I seriously doubt anyone will even come close. We can basically give them anything and everything they want.
Posted by: Bullerwinkle May 4 2009, 12:26 PM
Salmons is only 6' 6" Deng is 6' 8" and a better rebounder you can use Salmons at guard as well so to me that makes him more valuable from the bench. Of course there could be times when you wanna start Salmons over Deng and you'll have that flexibility.
Posted by: Bullerwinkle May 4 2009, 12:29 PM
Not as I saw things. Miller isn't what he used to be and if you ask me he cost the Bulls the series in game five.l I won't argue though because you can make an argument for keeping Miller.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 4 2009, 12:53 PM
I'm not saying keep Miller for Miller's sake, I'm saying his contract is now one of the big 2010 expiring contracts. Either you hold that solely because it helps you open up cap space next year, or you use that as your deal-maker for a team that wants cap space.
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 4 2009, 01:49 PM
Salmons can play 2 guard but he's not quick enough to star there IMO. He can play in spurts but his natural position is small forward.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 4 2009, 04:33 PM
He doesn't need to "Star" there, he needs to give me 15 points and reasonably good defense alongside our developing star PG.
I'd rather keep Gordon and use Salmons as the backup SF and SG, but if we simply can't do that...Salmons has already shown himself to be a solid backup option.
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 4 2009, 04:52 PM
I'd rather keep Gordon and use Salmons as the backup SF and SG, but if we simply can't do that...Salmons has already shown himself to be a solid backup option.
Woops I meant "Start" not star.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 4 2009, 05:20 PM
Are we looking to get anything out of trading kirk besides expiring contracts?
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 4 2009, 05:34 PM
If we do, then it hurts our chances at 2010 cap space if that's what we're after...and it really kills our chances of extending Gordon (even a draft pick this year is extra money against the cap).
The one way that everything could work out is if you can: 1. Trade Kirk for something useful to a team that has some cap space to take his contract on without giving us the full amount back, then trade for Bosh this offseason using Miller/James's expiring deal as the bulk of the salary, and then you probably still have room to extend Gordon and Bosh as well.
You don't say no if someone wants to give you back something useful for Hinrich, but if you can trade him and get back nothing other than $5 mil in cap space and a 2nd round pick, it's the right move.
Posted by: Wanne May 4 2009, 05:36 PM
First off I want Ben resigned...shooters like that don't grow on trees. Other than that...I just really want to dump Deng.
Posted by: rockren May 4 2009, 09:46 PM
Yeah that's pretty much impossible.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 4 2009, 09:51 PM
Or at least hire a coach who knows how to use him
Posted by: Sanitarium May 4 2009, 09:54 PM
also, to whoever said that they want us to draft BJ Mullens... NO.
i saw him in person once this year as well and saw about half a dozen other full games... he is without a doubt the most overrated player in this years class. Imagine Noah but slower, stupider, weaker, and with 1000% less drive.
You'd still have a player that is better than BJ Mullens. He didn't even start for ohio state because he puts no effort into rebounding, has no offense when he's not within half an arms length of the basket, and doesn't care about defense. What about any of that sounds appealing to you?
Posted by: rockren May 4 2009, 09:55 PM
That said, Tyrus gives them a far more defense-oriented player at the power forward spot (I'm assuming Marion isn't back), so he could blend a bit better with Bargnani than Bosh since the latter gives them another big that gets a large percentage of his shots on jumpers. They'd need someone else to replace Bosh' scoring though, guys like Calderon and Parker can't really take over with their scoring.
I've seen Bargnani in person twice. One of the games was when Jermaine O'Neal was still a Raptor. There were possessions where he was chased out of the paint by Bosh and Jermaine.
I think Bargnani's offenive talents are obvious and his back to the basket game is a work in progress...but he has potential in that aspect. He got the ball more and more in the post after O'Neal was traded and he looked good. At 23, there is room for his back to the basket game to grow.
I agree he's more like Dirk, but Bargnani will be able to score inside with regularity. I also believe Bargnani would be capable of picking up the scoring slack from Bosh in time. If Toronto doesn't buy into Bargnani being a guy they can build around....they had no business taking him #1 overall years ago. Weak draft or not...they have to view him as a building block.
Posted by: SoxFan1 May 4 2009, 10:04 PM
My ultimate scenario:
- Re-sign Ben Gordon
- Fire Vinny Del Negro and Hire Thom Thibedeau as head coach
- Trade Deng/Tyrus/2009 1st for Bosh
- Draft a versatile bench player (Dajuan Blair, BJ Mullens, Terrence Williams, Wayne Ellington, Danny Green, etc.)
Looking at...
PG Rose
SG Gordon
SF Salmons
PF Bosh
C Noah
Hinrich, Miller, Draftee, Thomas (Tim), Hunter, Gray, Fillers
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 5 2009, 06:52 AM
i saw him in person once this year as well and saw about half a dozen other full games... he is without a doubt the most overrated player in this years class. Imagine Noah but slower, stupider, weaker, and with 1000% less drive.
You'd still have a player that is better than BJ Mullens. He didn't even start for ohio state because he puts no effort into rebounding, has no offense when he's not within half an arms length of the basket, and doesn't care about defense. What about any of that sounds appealing to you?
I'm not saying I REALLY want to take him (there are better options), but for a late round pick, you really don't find guys with more upside. Yes, he's clearly a work in progress and there's zero chance he starts for us. You can say that about 90% of the guys in this draft class though, it's not like you're passing on a much safer bet if you take him. A 7-footer with athleticism is very rarely available that late in the draft. Noah isn't the greatest comparison, he has much better size and explosive leaping ability while having none of the motor and energy. He's not exactly a statue in the mobility department either, and it'd be hard to be dumber than Tyrus and Noah (though I'm not arguing that he's smart). If he does happen to pan out he's more like a more explosive Chris Kaman by most accounts (he looks like a less-skilled Amare Stoudemire to me, but that sounds better than it really is), which we could definitely use.
Granted he has a very high bust factor given his lack of polish, but if he does happen to work out you have a definite asset. For a team with glaring needs he's an awful pick, for a team in the latter half of the first that made the playoffs and can afford to take the risk he could work out brilliantly.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 5 2009, 07:25 AM
I suppose, but ohio state centers don't exactly have the best reputation these days.
Does anyone know if Gani Lawal has declared?
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 5 2009, 07:33 AM
Does anyone know if Gani Lawal has declared?
There really only is one other one, and he's been hurt so much I find it hard to complain about 9-7 with a block in under 22 minutes in his rookie year, though it is well below expectations and he's fouling at an absurd rate.
Lawal is in, but he's basically Tyrus without the ridiculous leaping ability (good but not elite) and has no shooting ability whatsoever. He'll never see the floor between the presence of Tyrus and the frequency of the small lineup. He's a better player right now than Mullens, but at least the latter has size, something we don't have (again, not really endorsing the pick).
Posted by: Sanitarium May 5 2009, 09:23 AM
Oh ok, I haven't seen much of Lawal.
God i don't care who we draft really as long as they can post up once in a while
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 5 2009, 09:25 AM
God i don't care who we draft really as long as they can post up once in a while
Unfortunately in this class none of the bigs are terribly likely to be solid contributors after Griffin.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 5 2009, 09:31 AM
Yeah, honestly outside of Rubio, Griffin, and Thabeet I really am not all that impressed with this draft class. (But Lester Hudson is my sleeper)
Posted by: GreatScott82 May 5 2009, 11:53 AM
- Re-sign Ben Gordon
- Fire Vinny Del Negro and Hire Thom Thibedeau as head coach
- Trade Deng/Tyrus/2009 1st for Bosh
- Draft a versatile bench player (Dajuan Blair, BJ Mullens, Terrence Williams, Wayne Ellington, Danny Green, etc.)
Looking at...
PG Rose
SG Gordon
SF Salmons
PF Bosh
C Noah
Hinrich, Miller, Draftee, Thomas (Tim), Hunter, Gray, Fillers
If Toronto is dumb enough to take Deng's contract than i would love to make this deal. Hinrich is a perfect 6th man, Salmons did a solid job as our SF this year, you still have Gordon's offensive production and make room for a true PF who can give you 20-10 every night.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 5 2009, 12:13 PM
One point I'd like to make in this thread....
Last season coming in to this season there was every reason to think the Bulls would take a step backwards. They had an overcrowded backcourt, not enough front court depth, new coach, and most importantly, a rookie PG who needed minutes more than anything else. Thus, Hinrich was going to the bench, guys like Thabo were buried, Tyrus and Noah were going to be stuck behind Gooden, Nocioni was going to get a lot of time at PF, and we really needed to make a trade or two to clear out the herd. Not making any changes was not an option.
This year...if we do absolutely nothing, there is plenty of reason to think we can get better. Tyrus and Noah can hopefully take another step forwards. Rose could be in for a huge step upwards next year. Deng returning, if he can give us anything/integrate in to what we have, would be a significant frontcourt upgrade. Adding in 2 mid to late 1st round picks may make our rotation a little deeper. Our bench is a better matchup for our starters already, just by getting rid of Noc/Gooden and bringing in Miller. The only thing we'd need to do to make that work is resign Gordon, and even if he walks, we can use Salmons as an adequate SG for next year...and then still go in to 2010 with a ton of cap space.
Last year, we needed to make a move to thin out the herd. When we finally made those moves, they made us a lot better. This year, we can basically stand pat and actually become a better team...which means if we're going to make a move, it needs to be for a real, legit upgrade.
Posted by: rockren May 5 2009, 08:38 PM
We'll still be a 1st Rnd exit IMO. While I'm thrilled of the Bulls potential and proud of their play against Boston...we matched up as well with "KG'less" Boston as we would have anyone in the 1st Round. I honestly believe the only teams we would've beaten in the 1st Round were Philly and Detroit...which isn't saying much. We've gotta get a guy to throw the ball into and not be solely reliant on jump shots. Those teams can only go so far and the Bulls know that.
If we don't find a way to move Hinrich, we'll be stuck with his 9 mil on the cap for 2010. If we for some reason held on to Kirk....then we'd have to let Tyrus walk in 2010 to sign Bosh to make it work inside the cap. It wouldn't be a huge deal considering we'd be getting Bosh anyway...but if Toronto decided to pass on a trade involving Tyrus in '09, I'd rather find a way to keep Tyrus around with Noah and Bosh if we could somehow make that work rather than spend the cash on Kirk. You could either way at this point...but looking into the future, I think it'll be an obvious decision at that time.
I'll be extremely disappointed if the Bulls stand pat this off-season. I'm not saying they need to roll the dice or anything, but a plan to add a guy like Bosh in '09 or wait for '10 has to be in place.
Posted by: dasox24 May 6 2009, 12:11 AM
Last season coming in to this season there was every reason to think the Bulls would take a step backwards. They had an overcrowded backcourt, not enough front court depth, new coach, and most importantly, a rookie PG who needed minutes more than anything else. Thus, Hinrich was going to the bench, guys like Thabo were buried, Tyrus and Noah were going to be stuck behind Gooden, Nocioni was going to get a lot of time at PF, and we really needed to make a trade or two to clear out the herd. Not making any changes was not an option.
This year...if we do absolutely nothing, there is plenty of reason to think we can get better. Tyrus and Noah can hopefully take another step forwards. Rose could be in for a huge step upwards next year. Deng returning, if he can give us anything/integrate in to what we have, would be a significant frontcourt upgrade. Adding in 2 mid to late 1st round picks may make our rotation a little deeper. Our bench is a better matchup for our starters already, just by getting rid of Noc/Gooden and bringing in Miller. The only thing we'd need to do to make that work is resign Gordon, and even if he walks, we can use Salmons as an adequate SG for next year...and then still go in to 2010 with a ton of cap space.
Last year, we needed to make a move to thin out the herd. When we finally made those moves, they made us a lot better. This year, we can basically stand pat and actually become a better team...which means if we're going to make a move, it needs to be for a real, legit upgrade.
Exactly. You just summed up my entire thoughts on this off-season. I'm perfectly content standing pat if we can't make a trade that lands us a Bosh or star player like that.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 6 2009, 07:36 AM
I thought about this a bit yesterday...
If you went in to the 2010 offseason exactly as we are now, and you were able to sign Bosh, that would mean you'd have to outright Tyrus to clear the last bit of cap space.
In other words, you'd be doing a straight up trade of Tyrus for Bosh, in some sense, on your roster. It'd cost you some cap space, but you wouldn't lose anything else.
That's not the worst trade I've ever heard.
Although, it does require we lose Gordon this offseason.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 6 2009, 07:50 AM
This may be just a wild idea, but is there any possibility that JR Smith doesnt return to denver this offseason? What if we dumped Gordon and picked up Smith?
Posted by: dasox24 May 6 2009, 01:04 PM
I doubt we'd be interested. Remember that Pax shipped him off to Denver for two 2nd round picks right after we acquired him in the Chandler deal.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 6 2009, 01:59 PM
Tim Thomas says hi.
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 7 2009, 05:20 AM
We essentially acquired Tim Thomas' salary, we're not exactly expecting him to play a major role on the team.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 7 2009, 07:36 AM
Apparently the Heat are looking to make a trade to get a first round pick this year. I don't really know what we could get out of them for one of ours
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 7 2009, 09:32 AM
Out of their roster, assume Chalmers we don't want because we have a PG, Wade isn't moving, Beasley I dunno how low they are on him (no unless they really soured on him last year), Jermaine O'Neal they'd probably be willing to move but that $22 million he earns next year is a bit rough (it'd be Deng + Hinrich + the draft pick or soemthing like that), Jamario Moon doesn't really excite me, then the others are backup guys like Daquean Cook and Jamaal Magliore.
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 7 2009, 09:39 AM
The Heat's roster is pretty damn awful outside of Wade. Granted I like Chalmers and Beasley, but they're pretty average players at the moment (granted Beasley is a talented offensive player that got better late in the season, but he makes Rose look decent on D).
Posted by: GreatScott82 May 7 2009, 04:11 PM
Okay assuming the Bulls let Gordon walk, or a trade involving Hinrich for an expirering contract- giving them cap space to sign Gordon, the Bulls should be in great shape to take on a Superstar in the summer of 2010.
What players are likely to stay with there teams?
1) Kobe Bryant- many expect him to opt to finish his contract with LA, however, with Phil Jackson getting older and him being on the last year of his deal, would Kobe really want to come back after this season? LaMar Odom is going to depart via free agency making there team a little weaker for next season as well. I predict he will opt to stay, but if LA loses before they reach the Finals, I could see Phil saying farewell and Kobe opting to leave for a new scenary. The Bulls would have to take on that luxory tax for one season if he comes here, but it is sure something to think about.. . Keep an eye on that Laker-Rocket series......
Its far fetched to think Kobe will leave LA, but you never know........
2) Lebron- He'll likely stay in Cleveland or head to New York. I just don't see him going anywhere else. Sorry fantasizers who had great dreams with Lebron in a Bulls uniform.
3) Dwayne Wade- Another guy i expect to remain with his team. However, if there is a team i could see him going to, it would be the Bulls- his hometown team. Many question if a backcourt of Wade and Rose would work. Ummm yea it would most definitley work!!!
4) Chris Bosh- The answer to our low post problems. Many speculate to whether he will be dealt this offseason. Pax should definitley look into it. But if Toronto is asking for too much, he will be available in 2010. The Bulls shouldn't act desperate this offseason to get this guy. But he would give us a tremendous boost to reach the top 4 seeds in the East next season.
5) Nowitski- Guy is a scoring machine. But he would be another one of those non-defensive guys that we cant really afford.
6) Amare Stoudemire- This is what we expect Tyrus Thomas to develope into. I'd rather continue to develop THomas at a much cheaper cost than spend loads of money on Amare. We need to use that money on other needs.
Summary- Either D Wade or Bosh to the Bulls in 2010! As far as next year goes. We would be in decent shape if just stood still this offseason and let guys like Thomas, Noah and Rose to improve there games.
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 7 2009, 06:22 PM
Summary- Either D Wade or Bosh to the Bulls in 2010! As far as next year goes. We would be in decent shape if just stood still this offseason and let guys like Thomas, Noah and Rose to improve there games.
I really hope no one still believes that, he'd have to double his PPG and add about 10% to his field goal percentage.
They're not in THAT great of shape, unless they can dump Hinrich or Deng they'll have to let their second best player walk as well as out-right Tyrus to offer a max contract.
Posted by: rockren May 8 2009, 03:41 AM
If the Bulls wanted Amare in the least...they'd have him already. There is a reason the Suns were offered pretty much next to nothing for Amare at last year's deadline...he's one of the more overrated players we'll ever see.
No disrespect to his offensive game as he's extremely talented around the basket, but that's it. As far as Tyrus developing into Amare, he's already far superior to that of Amare defensively. I watched Amare try to defend the pick n roll in Milwaukee a couple years ago...that was the biggest joke I've ever seen. When the Bulls were rumored to have wanted Amare this year I immediately screamed NO. I want no part of Amare in Chicago.
Posted by: rockren May 8 2009, 03:43 AM
Eh...they'll be in great shape shortly after they let Gordon walk and deal Hinrich for expiring contracts.
Posted by: dasox24 May 8 2009, 04:11 AM
I'd definitely do that purely for O'Neal's expiring contract. That would allow us to re-sign Gordon this off-season and still have the cap space to sign a guy to a max deal in 2010 (I don't care if that involves out-righting Tyrus... that's a trade I'm willing to make if it gets us a star big man). Our depth would be hurting a bit for next year, but we'd still have a 1st round pick.
Next year is like a bonus year for me. Anything extra we get (like Noah developing offensively or Rose becoming a much better defender) is great, but I try to look at next season realistically. We aren't going to win a championship with the team we have now. My main goal for next year is to see the continual improvement of Rose, Noah, and our draft pick (so he can turn into a solid role player) so we can contend in 2-3 years. I'm willing to make the short-term downgrade in talent (Deng/Hinrich to O'Neal) to better ourselves for the long-run. Now, obviously, my outlook changes if Pax makes a deal for, say, Chris Bosh.
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 8 2009, 08:04 AM
No disrespect to his offensive game as he's extremely talented around the basket, but that's it. As far as Tyrus developing into Amare, he's already far superior to that of Amare defensively. I watched Amare try to defend the pick n roll in Milwaukee a couple years ago...that was the biggest joke I've ever seen. When the Bulls were rumored to have wanted Amare this year I immediately screamed NO. I want no part of Amare in Chicago.
No one will argue that Amare is a good defender, however the gap between Amare's offense and our interior offense is quite a bit bigger than the gap between our interior defense and Amare's interior defense. We're not exactly stopping anyone as it is, that's why we let Glen freakin' Davis average about 17-7 for the series and made Kendrick Perkins look like a mini Dwight Howard.
I'm kind of torn as to whether I want him or not given the high cost and those defensive deficiencies (plus his effort seems pretty inconsistent), but there's no question he's an upgrade that would help the team and would immediately become our second best player. The debate is whether that upgrade ends up being large enough to justify killing our cap space for the next 6 years or so.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 8 2009, 10:13 AM
When we put Amare on the bench for 18 minutes for the 4 guard lineup, the offense will be a wash.
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 8 2009, 11:36 AM
I wonder if Amare was watching us against the Celtics and thinking "Man, I'm the missing piece, If I were there we would have won the series for sure." 
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 8 2009, 12:48 PM
If VDN would have played him instead of benching him as the PF, he's right.
Posted by: rockren May 9 2009, 08:42 PM
Amare absolutely wouldn't have changed that. As a matter of fact...Pierce probably would have had a much better series if we would have had Amare in place of Tyrus. All of those free jumpers Big Baby shot were by design. Tyrus/Noah were leaving the big guys routinely to help out with Pierce and Rondo as they came to the basket.
Yeah, it's safe to say Amare would've dominated inside offensively against those guys, but I believe the series result would have been the same. Probably a waste of time to even talk about, but just MO.
At the end of the day, Tyrus is 4 years younger than Amare and is already better defensively. If it were up to me, I'd rather re-sign Tyrus if we had to, rather than dealing for Amare.
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 10 2009, 12:17 PM
Yeah, it's safe to say Amare would've dominated inside offensively against those guys, but I believe the series result would have been the same. Probably a waste of time to even talk about, but just MO.
At the end of the day, Tyrus is 4 years younger than Amare and is already better defensively. If it were up to me, I'd rather re-sign Tyrus if we had to, rather than dealing for Amare.
No they weren't. The Celtics almost never run a play off Davis. He gets all of his shots from the other player's garbage. The reason he got so many shots is because he was open. I don't think the Celtics ever actually designed plays for him to shoot.
Posted by: ChWRoCk2 May 10 2009, 10:37 PM
Other players garbage? Most his shots he made were fouls on layups and mid range jumpers.
He was wide open every shot and he drained just about every mid range jumper. What more do you want from him, if a player isnt gonna miss those shots you feed it to him which is what they did. Wouldn't be surprised if some were designed to go to him, fwiw he hit a game winner today.
Posted by: rockren May 10 2009, 11:57 PM
I meant by design on behalf of the Bulls defense...they left him alone on purpose.
MUCH LIKE ORLANDO DID TONIGHT!! BAZZZZZZZINNNGGGGG
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise May 14 2009, 05:39 PM
Von Wafer is a free agent, what do you guys think about him as a cheap option off the bench? He's only 23 and is 6'5. Pretty much a JR Smith type without the attitude.
Posted by: SoxFan1 May 14 2009, 08:55 PM
He's super streaky and he's a chucker. He'll probably want more than what we'd offer.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 14 2009, 10:42 PM
Not as consistent as JR Smith. He could be decent if he had better shot selection and he is pretty atheletic finishing in the paint from what little i've seen.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 15 2009, 10:06 AM
What people are going to want this offseason is irrelevant. It's what people are going to get that matters. With few teams having cap space, with virtually 2/3 of the league losing money it seems, and with a number of big names available on the market, no one is giving Von Wafer the MLE. Ben Gordon may be lucky to get the MLE from someone.
Posted by: dasox24 May 22 2009, 12:26 PM
http://espn.go.com/chicago/columns/blog?post=4198671&name=swirsky
Working out the bigs
May 22, 2009, 9:24 AM
By: Chuck Swirsky
The first college players working out for the Bulls on Friday include six players who play either center or power forward.
Chicagoan Mac Koshwal will be on display. He played two years under Jerry Wainwright at DePaul and averaged 12 points and 9 rebounds this past season. He has yet to hire an agent.
A player that I'm anxious to get a read on is Ohio State seven-footer B.J. Mullens. He has terrific hands and is a solid athlete but is a below-average passer. He's got a body built for the NBA, but is not a finished product. He will be on the board at No. 16, the first of two first-round picks for the Bulls.
Taj Gibson may be a good pick at 26. He'll be at the Berto Center on Friday as well. He's a 6-foot-9 junior out of USC. A bit undersized and needs to add strength but a good mid-range game and traffic rebounder.
Scott Vandemeer, a seven-footer out of Illinois-Chicago, will be working out as well.
We'll have updates after the morning session.
Ricky Rubio, projected by many to be the second player taken in the draft behind Oklahoma's Blake Griffin, is apparently not a happy camper that he could be headed to Memphis.
On a side note, that last sentence makes me feel bad for the Grizzlies. What the fish would be so bad about playing in Memphis? Just b/c Pau Gasol's a little whiny beach and got his way out of Memphis doesn't mean it would be bad for the next Spaniard. Look, Ricky. Man the fish up, and pay your dues like everyone else (sans Steve Francis) in this league, and then leave Memphis after your contract is up if you hate it that much.
If I'm the Grizz, I would definitely think about trading the #2 pick for the Knicks' #8 and David Lee. Though, even moreso if I were the Grizzlies' GM, I'd try my hardest to get Griffin from the Clippers. In all honesty, I think Rubio would be a better fit for LAC and Griffin for the Grizz, but unfortunately that won't happen. I guess you never know with the Clipper's management, though.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 22 2009, 01:02 PM
The Clippers have already said they are taking Griffin.
As for Rubio, what a tool. I mean Marc Gasol, PAU's OWN BROTHER, doesn't seem to have that much beef with Memphis... so I think it's just Rubio being a brat.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 22 2009, 01:44 PM
I think he has a legit complaint if the Grizzlies are the one team with cap space and they continually refuse to use it.
Posted by: SoxFan1 May 22 2009, 02:02 PM
Get me BJ Mullens.
Posted by: dasox24 May 23 2009, 04:58 PM
That's true they haven't used it, but why use cap space just to use it? I know they're having financial problems, but I think if the right player came along in free agency, they'd make a play. Prime example: They signed Josh Smith last year to a big contract, but the Hawks matched it. I know that it was pretty likely the Hawks were going to match it all along, but if the Grizz were really against spending their cap space, I don't think they would have signed Smith to that big of a deal. I don't blame them for not wanting to spend money unless they get the right player considering the financial struggles they're having.
Anyway... Unfortunately for them, they really need a legit big man and this happens to be a draft that isn't very strong in that department. If they do take Rubio and he ends up being as good as people think he'll be, then they'd have a very legit 1-2-3 in Rubio-Mayo-Gay. Darrell Arthur and Marc Gasol can be solid big men, but nothing more. They need an impact player in the post to have a real shot in the West. But, Mayo and Gay aren't a bad place to start talent-wise.
Posted by: rockren May 24 2009, 11:38 PM
Anyway... Unfortunately for them, they really need a legit big man and this happens to be a draft that isn't very strong in that department. If they do take Rubio and he ends up being as good as people think he'll be, then they'd have a very legit 1-2-3 in Rubio-Mayo-Gay. Darrell Arthur and Marc Gasol can be solid big men, but nothing more. They need an impact player in the post to have a real shot in the West. But, Mayo and Gay aren't a bad place to start talent-wise.
I don't think its anything against Memphis...but I feel Rubio had his heart set on Washington. Washington is a bigger market (nation's capitol, which might matter to a foreign player) that just brought in Flip Saunders...and could've given Rubio a chance to be on a high powered offensive powerhouse right out of the box.
They could've slid Gilbert to the 2, Butler to the 3, Jamison to the 4, Blatche/Haywood at the 5 with Rubio running the club. Whether or not Arenas would've been down with that, I don't think Washington would've had a choice with his durability issues the past two years. With Flip's offensive expertise and that lineup could have been one of the highest scoring teams in the league and a playoff team in the East health permitting.
That's probably why Rubio is upset about Memphis.
Posted by: rockren May 24 2009, 11:44 PM
http://www.nbadraft.net/node/5979
From what we can gather, Rubio is most certainly going to want to have a large say in the team that drafts him, and if he’s not satisfied with where he lands, he may just decide not to ever come over, which would obviously be a huge embarrassment for the team that picks him. He is in a great situation with his hometown team outside of Barcelona, and it wouldn’t make sense to leave there for anything less than the perfect spot from his standpoint.
I'd be shocked if Rubio was with the Grizz far beyond draft night.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 25 2009, 09:16 AM
kinda related, but didn't Peja Stojakvich get drafted and then not enter the league for like another year or so?
Posted by: DutheDoduhon21 May 25 2009, 10:17 AM
NBA sources continue to indicate that the Los Angeles Clippers are entertaining offers for the No. 1 pick. Despite their initial comments made on draft night about having already decided to pick Blake Griffin, they are keeping all their options open for now. "From what I understand, they didn't want to sound uncertain on draft night, since that's a typical Clippers reaction. This is a very important time for them in terms of season ticket renewals, which is why they had that kneejerk reaction."
we do have 2 firstround picks, what could we package together?
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 25 2009, 10:35 AM
I bet they'd trade the pick straight up for that Rose kid.
Seriously, unless we can offer them some major cap relief at the same time as giving them 2 picks, it's not going to work out. It'd be something like the pick, Davis, and Randolph for Tyrus, Miller, our 2 picks, and Jerome James...thus the Bulls go straight in to luxury tax territory for the next 2-3 years, lose all their 2010 cap space, lose Gordon, and have to pay Baron Davis's contract. Probably another pick (2011?) thrown in as well. It'd be an exciting young pairing...but there's no motivation for the Clippers to do it unless you make them a lot better at the same time.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 25 2009, 12:12 PM
I say trade with the Grizz and take Thabeet
Posted by: SoxFan1 May 25 2009, 01:56 PM
You got a link for that?
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 25 2009, 02:07 PM
Why? We've already got two offensively-challenged big men. I really don't see what Thabeet gives us that Noah doesn't, I wouldn't give up anything remotely valuable to get him/that pick.
Now Griffin on the other hand, wow if the Clippers are dumb enough...
Posted by: DutheDoduhon21 May 25 2009, 03:01 PM
http://www.fannation.com/truth_and_rumors/view/103970-clippers-entertaining-offers-for-top-pick?eref=fromSI
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 25 2009, 03:57 PM
If they could get someone to take on Davis and Randolph's contracts, or Davis and Kaman, something like that, while at the same time getting back a boatload of picks (2-3 first rounders) and wind up with $20 million + in cap space at the end of next season, that'd be a smart business move and a decent basketball move for them.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 25 2009, 05:49 PM
Why would another team want the whole Clippers front court?
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 25 2009, 06:19 PM
Bulls fans have been after Kaman and Randolph for years.
Seriously...you wouldn't want them. But frankly, the Clippers shouldn't want them either (except Kaman...he's expensive but at least does moderately well). If I'm the Clips, I'm better off sitting Randolph on the bench and letting Davis try to stay motivated and healthy while waiting on them to turn in to expiring contracts and playing my # 1 draft choice than I am doing anything else...unless you take those contracts off my hands so that I can make a max contract run next year.
Posted by: ZoomSlowik May 25 2009, 08:59 PM
It would be an AWFUL basketball move. You're not going to get enough picks or high enough picks to compensate for losing a prospect like Griffin, and losing Davis and/or Kaman for a pile of rookies/cap space isn't going to make you better in the near future either. Even if you somehow got a player like Tyrus, Tyreke Evans/James Harden and Derrick Favors/Greg Monroe/John Henson (which would take two lottery picks, a pretty damn lofty package) you'd almost certainly be better off with Griffin, Davis and Kaman. It's not like the Clippers are going to get one of the studs of 2010 to sign there, why in god's name would you chose to be a Clipper if you could avoid it?
The only possible validation for a move like that would be the reduced hit on Sterlings' bank account, which unfortunately might be enough. The smarter move by a wide margin (unless someone pulls an Isaiah and takes Randolph) is to try to get picks and cap space for Kaman since he's moveable and relatively replaceable, build around Griffin and Gordon, then hope you get a nice pick next year. Moving Griffin in a salary-shedding deal like that gives you an awful team with an organization that doesn't have the smarts to turn multiple picks and cap space into a good team.
Posted by: rockren May 26 2009, 04:52 PM
Seriously...you wouldn't want them. But frankly, the Clippers shouldn't want them either (except Kaman...he's expensive but at least does moderately well). If I'm the Clips, I'm better off sitting Randolph on the bench and letting Davis try to stay motivated and healthy while waiting on them to turn in to expiring contracts and playing my # 1 draft choice than I am doing anything else...unless you take those contracts off my hands so that I can make a max contract run next year.
This is the really the Clips only option with Isiah being out of the league.
Posted by: rockren May 26 2009, 05:09 PM
http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=296041
Kills two birds with one stone on this article...
Whether the Clips will move Kaman and if the Bulls are shopping Tyrus.
Posted by: rockren May 26 2009, 05:10 PM
Will Rubio stay in Spain?
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Insider
Ford By Chad Ford
ESPN.com
Archive
The Ricky Rubio rumors are flying around, and some of the speculation is overheated. Let's sort out the substance from the hot air.
Over the course of the last week, I've read or heard that Rubio would be (a) withdrawing from the draft, (
staying in the draft and being selected, according to various conflicting rumors, by the Los Angeles Clippers, Memphis Grizzlies, Oklahoma City Thunder and Sacramento Kings, and © staying in the draft but refusing to come to the NBA this year if he had to play for the Grizzlies or Thunder.
This comes after months of hand-wringing over whether he would even declare for the draft.
The fact is, Rubio's situation likely will require a few weeks of negotiation and decision-making on all sides to be resolved. We just don't know what will happen, and neither does Rubio.
The key questions:
1. Will he stay in the draft?
He has until June 15 to decide whether to withdraw from the draft, though sources close to the situation insist that there's virtually no chance that he withdraws.
2. Will he sign with the team that drafts him?
To terminate his contract with his Spanish team, he would have to pay about $7.5 million (about 5.35 million euro) on his own, in addition to the $500,000 an NBA team could contribute. While his camp would try to negotiate a smaller settlement, the question remains: Will his situation in the NBA be appealing enough to him to persuade him to pay such a buyout since he appears to have a good situation in Spain?
According to sources close to Rubio, he doesn't want to play for the Grizzlies, who hold the No. 2 pick. While he's more open to playing for the Thunder (No. 3), the team isn't a great fit for him.
I'm told Rubio's objections have nothing to do with the cities themselves and that he would not have a problem playing in a smaller market. The issues appear to be the state of the respective franchises and how he would fit on each team.
The Grizzlies have a starting point guard, Mike Conley, the No. 4 pick in 2007, and they have talked about potentially making O.J. Mayo, just named to the NBA's All-Rookie team, the point guard of the future. The Thunder made large strides this season with another All-Rookie guard, Russell Westbrook, running the point. Conley and Mayo are 21 years old, and Westbrook is just 20, so it's unclear how the Memphis and Oklahoma City situations would develop if Rubio were to enter the picture and how he would fit.
Rubio's camp is hoping that a team that they believe is a better fit for Rubio -- in particular, the Kings or the New York Knicks -- will trade up to get the No. 2 or No. 3 pick in the draft and take Rubio.
It's unclear whether Memphis will seriously attempt to reel in Rubio. Sources continue to insist that Grizzlies owner Michael Heisley prefers Hasheem Thabeet to Rubio, but it appears that's not the biggest stumbling block to drafting Rubio. If Heisley's basketball people insisted on Rubio, he would probably relent. The bigger issue, then, is that Rubio could, if drafted by Memphis, choose to go back and play in Europe next year.
Even if the Grizzlies ultimately decide not to draft Rubio, they need to persuade other teams that Memphis is the team to work with in Rubio trade talks. That may explain why the Grizzlies have gone out of their way the past few days to emphasize how much they like Rubio and how smoothly talks with his representatives have been going. For a team that's been pretty secretive in the past about the draft, they're suddenly quite talkative.
Rubio's team has interest in him going No. 2, as well. Going that high would increase his salary and perhaps his stardom. Given that he would have to pay a huge buyout in Spain, that's a big deal to Rubio.
While we'll keep our ear to the ground, the truth is that Rubio's situation almost certainly will require a few weeks to resolve itself.
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 27 2009, 10:17 AM
Does the Ricky Rubio situation remind anyone of the Yi Jianlian situation a few years ago?
Posted by: DutheDoduhon21 May 27 2009, 10:53 AM
from the trib
K.C. Johnson
With two first-round picks in what is widely considered to be a weak draft, it’s impossible to predict what the Bulls will do on June 25.
Nevertheless, news that the Bulls worked out Jonny Flynn over the weekend is intriguing merely because most mock drafts have the Syracuse point guard listed as a lottery pick. The Bulls own the 16th and 26th selections.
Flynn worked out with St. Mary’s point guard Patrick Mills and Arkansas point guard and Marshall High graduate Patrick Beverley. The Bulls didn’t announce the workout, which is a fairly common practice.
The Bulls also conducted a workout of wing players with reputations of athleticism that included Arizona’s Chase Budinger
i dont think flynn will be there at 16, but that would be a nice pick.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 27 2009, 12:19 PM
^I think thats why it mentioned us having the two first rounders so we would have to trade up to grab him. Budinger might be around at 16... but I think there a few other teams in that pick range interested in him as well.
Posted by: rockren May 28 2009, 12:18 AM
i dont think flynn will be there at 16, but that would be a nice pick.
I agree. Flynn won't fall past Milwaukee at 10 IMO. There is word he's been fantastic in workouts and is rumored to be loved by Sacramento.
I saw him against Marquette at the Bradley Center this year and he looked great. He took on some of Marquette's bigger Gs in McNeal and Matthews and had no problem with them.
Posted by: Sanitarium May 28 2009, 08:53 AM
Except for Jianlian is god awful
Posted by: Balta1701-B May 28 2009, 10:19 AM
And no one knew that until he played here. Half of the Bulls fans were hoping he'd drop to #9.
Posted by: dasox24 Jun 8 2009, 11:50 PM
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-09-bulls-bitsjun09,0,2275375.story
Duke guard Henderson visits Berto Center
Gerald Henderson couldn't hide the $100 worth of meal money the Bulls had given him under rules of the collective bargaining agreement following his draft workout Monday.
So the Duke shooting guard proved his humor is as accomplished as his defensive ability when asked why, even though he's projected as a lottery pick, he sweated his day away at the Berto Center.
"This right here," Henderson said, holding up the bill. "I want to get paid like Luol."
Indeed, fellow Duke star Luol Deng signed a lucrative deal last summer, four years after undergoing a draft workout similar to Henderson's.
Henderson joined a high-profile group that included Arizona small forward Chase Budinger, USC power forward Taj Gibson and Israeli swingman Omri Casspi.
The Bulls own the 16th and 26th picks in the June 25 NBA draft.
"They have a great coach and a great team," Henderson said. "It's a place I'd love to play. That's why I'm here."
Henderson, the son of three-time NBA champion Gerald Sr., had previously visited Charlotte and Phoenix and called Monday's his toughest workout yet. He has six or seven more planned.
"They wanted to see how you compete," Henderson said. "That's something at Duke we go about every day. Defensively, I feel I have a step up having good principles coming from a program that that's what we base our games on."
Casspi is projected to be available at No. 26 and shot down speculation he'd stay in Europe another season.
"I'm here to play in the NBA next year," Casspi said. "I don't know how this speculation came out. Nobody has talked to me about going back to Europe."
Staff scribblings: All signs continue to point to Pete Myers returning to the assistant coaching bench role he held during Scott Skiles' tenure. Myers spent last season in a limited, behind-the-bench role but is expected to take Del Harris' spot after Harris' retirement last week.
The Bulls also have held internal discussions about keeping Lindsey Hunter as a part-time player or as a player development coach. Hunter attended Monday's draft workout.
I like the idea of keeping Hunter around... And so much for Casspi being an option to draft and have him stay in Europe. If we take him, looks like he'd be on the team next year.
Posted by: rockren Jun 11 2009, 07:59 PM
I like the idea of keeping Hunter around... And so much for Casspi being an option to draft and have him stay in Europe. If we take him, looks like he'd be on the team next year.
Great tidbits of info in that article.
I also very much like the idea of keeping Hunter in the fold at some capacity. I got the impression that Rose really took to him last year.
Posted by: Sanitarium Jun 15 2009, 11:40 AM
Gani Lawal and Tyler Smith just pulled out of the draft
Posted by: dasox24 Jun 15 2009, 04:32 PM
Probably a smart decision by both of them, especially Smith who would have not been a 1st rounder (Lawal probably would have been, but a late one).
Posted by: Sanitarium Jun 15 2009, 05:11 PM
I wouldn't have minded us taking a chance on Tyler Smith... but I would rather see him back at tennessee.
Harangody has also backed out of the draft as well.
Posted by: DutheDoduhon21 Jun 18 2009, 10:27 PM
really OT: shelden williams twitter
my money is on westbrook to win. rose may call himself the ping pong champ but for some reason i dont see him as a good bowler.
Posted by: SoxFan1 Jun 23 2009, 12:30 PM
via ESPN
Posted by: Sanitarium Jun 23 2009, 06:50 PM
if we trade with portland i want rudy fernandez
Posted by: rockren Jun 23 2009, 11:41 PM
They may as well throw in Roy to sweeten the pot.
Posted by: SoxFan1 Jun 23 2009, 11:46 PM
I'd require that we also get Lamarcus Aldridge back.
Posted by: rockren Jun 24 2009, 12:10 AM
We could sprinkle a little Brad Miller in there and see if Oden is available? No?
Posted by: Sanitarium Jun 30 2009, 09:49 PM
i know that detroit are probably the team that wants BG the most, but why? and does Gordon really want to go there and be a 6th man again?
Posted by: Chicago Bulls Franchise Jun 30 2009, 10:17 PM
I was thinking about that too. They still don't even have a coach AND their going to be a horrible team next year with no real young talent other than Stuckey. I just don't see how Gordon fits in with Detroit. He has a starting spot here, who knows there.
Posted by: SoxFan1 Jun 30 2009, 10:58 PM
Michael Curry and Rip Hamilton had a pretty big riff throughout the whole season last year. Curry really fell out of favor with the players fast, especially with Rip since he benched him for Iverson, who no one liked. Dumars put them in a bad situation last year with that trade. Stuckey turned out to be a lot worse than they had hoped last year. And they have REALLY soured on Tayshaun Prince. There is a reason they drafted 3 small forwards, one of which is a worse-defending Tayshaun Prince clone.
With that said, no one really knows whats going on right now, especially with Curry gone. Rip is probably happier, but the extension they gave him isn't pretty and with Boozer staying in Utah, there are a lot of question marks. Most reports actually say they value Millsap much higher than Boozer for whatever reasons. And they have been linked to Gordon for a long time now. If they do sign him, they're going to have a weird situation with Stuckey/Rip/Gordon/Bynum playing 2 spots and with the cluster of small forwards. And on top of all that, they have to figure out what to do at PF with Wallace probably leaving or probably retiring. Maxiell and Amir Johnson have been total flops for them too. You know things are bad when your most impressive/consistent big man last year was Kwame Brown.
Posted by: SoxFan1 Jul 1 2009, 12:58 AM
2 hours into free agency (or is it 3?) and Ben Gordon still apparently hasn't received an offer according to Sam Smith. Latest is that DET is going after Gordon and Villanueva.
Posted by: Sanitarium Jul 1 2009, 09:08 AM
Marc Stein:
Posted by: CryptViLL Jul 29 2009, 06:09 PM
Going to be interesting how the bulls do without Gordon this year. I think we may do better.
Posted by: Balta1701-B Aug 2 2009, 06:39 PM
The Bulls have waived Linton Johnson III and DeMarcus Nelson. The roster should be standing at 13.,
Posted by: eddog2 Aug 3 2009, 06:20 AM
I saw that the other day. It's interesting. Do the Bulls plan on going into the season with 13 or do they plan on picking up 1 or 2 more players. Someone like Johnson can always be added later to a 15 day contract if someone gets injured. Having 13 players will allow them to do a multiplayer deal and bring more players back then they send out but I don't think those are the type of trades this team needs to be looking for. Our next trade needs to send two or more players to bring back the start PF we are looking for.
Posted by: jorgefabregas Aug 4 2009, 10:38 AM
I read that they are planning on starting the season with 13 on the roster.
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