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> Botchin' Ben Gordon
AirScott
post Mar 31 2007, 04:03 PM
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OK, I had to start a thread about this. Ben Gordon is an awesome scorer, came up big a lot of times in the fourth quarter...but we HAVE to stop giving him the ball on final possessions. this is getting ridiculous. he missed how many game-winners in a row? he made one against Indiana, but he botched four chances today. FOUR CHANCES! why not Hinrich? why not try to get Deng the ball at 15-17 feet? why does it HAVE to be Gordon?
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Chicago Bulls Fr...
post Mar 31 2007, 04:21 PM
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Well we have Hinrich who isn't exactly clutch in the final seconds of a game because of the weak shots he throws up driving to the lane. You have Gordon who can't dribble so he should only be shooting off the move. Deng has shown he isn't clutch in the closing moments. So I'd still go to Gordon but not when he has the ball from the beginning. Let him spot up shoot.
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TeaLeafReaderII
post Mar 31 2007, 04:35 PM
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Bulls had plenty of chances to put this game away. Not all of them were botched by Ben Gordon. Hinrich didn't hustle after a lose ball and let Varejo easily scoop it up. The bigs had some trouble boxing out and getting rebounds. Wallace missed some free throws towards the end of regulation. Spiff happens.

Gordon and his 37 points on 50% shooting put the Bulls into a position to win the game. And there is no one in the league I'd rather have shooting that three as time exired in overtime.
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bschmaranz
post Mar 31 2007, 04:58 PM
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It's not really the fact of giving Gordon the ball, it's that he cannot create for himself. Skiles needs to draw something up for BG, not isolate him with a guy who has 6 inches on him (LeBron) is guarding him.

But yeah, giving him the last shot and chance to win the game four times today was one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen.
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eddog2
post Mar 31 2007, 05:18 PM
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Half the fans on this site are rediculous. It's not Ben Gordon or Scott Skiles. I'm actually happy Skiles still showed faith in BG (because he hasn't always). There is nobody on the Bulls team more capable of hitting a game winning shot. The problem is that teams know BG is going to get the ball and almost always try and trap him or double him. That's why a play should be drawn up where Hinrich drives and kicks. But the problem with that is that Hinrich doesn't ever kick the ball out. He wants to be the "man" and he throws up some aweful runner in the lane instead of kicking the ball out.

BG is not good dribbling out of double teams. Not many players are but with his height it makes it even more difficult for him to make decisions when he does get doubled or trapped.

I'll take the Bulls losing w/ BG getting the final shot over giving the final shot to Kirk. I wouldn't mind Kirk getting an open 3 or Luol getting an open jumper for the last shot but if you want someone to create their own shot Gordon is the one to do it as long as he's not doubled.
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Chicago Bulls Fr...
post Mar 31 2007, 05:26 PM
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QUOTE (TeaLeafReaderII @ Mar 31 2007, 05:28 PM) *
Bulls had plenty of chances to put this game away. Not all of them were botched by Ben Gordon. Hinrich didn't hustle after a lose ball and let Varejo easily scoop it up. The bigs had some trouble boxing out and getting rebounds. Wallace missed some free throws towards the end of regulation. Spiff happens.

Gordon and his 37 points on 50% shooting put the Bulls into a position to win the game. And there is no one in the league I'd rather have shooting that three as time exired in overtime.


I'll take Kobe biggrin.gif

QUOTE (eddog2 @ Mar 31 2007, 06:11 PM) *
Half the fans on this site are rediculous. It's not Ben Gordon or Scott Skiles. I'm actually happy Skiles still showed faith in BG (because he hasn't always). There is nobody on the Bulls team more capable of hitting a game winning shot. The problem is that teams know BG is going to get the ball and almost always try and trap him or double him. That's why a play should be drawn up where Hinrich drives and kicks. But the problem with that is that Hinrich doesn't ever kick the ball out. He wants to be the "man" and he throws up some aweful runner in the lane instead of kicking the ball out.

BG is not good dribbling out of double teams. Not many players are but with his height it makes it even more difficult for him to make decisions when he does get doubled or trapped.

I'll take the Bulls losing w/ BG getting the final shot over giving the final shot to Kirk. I wouldn't mind Kirk getting an open 3 or Luol getting an open jumper for the last shot but if you want someone to create their own shot Gordon is the one to do it as long as he's not doubled.


Im most frustrated with Gordon's inability to see the court and pass the ball effectively out of traffic. You see Tyrus get all those dunks from Kirk or Deng driving to the lane as they leave Tyrus wide open? Gordon already predetermined he was going to throw up a shot that he blatanly had no intention of passing the ball down low. I know he can hit the shot but he dribbles way too much so if he is dribbling then I would hope that he has his head on a swivel to feed the ball down low to one of the bigs or a slasher like Luol.

I don't want to throw one guy under the bus with a few horrible plays late in the game but he did have a nice shooting game, 37 points. It was such a good game to watch that there is no sense on cutting a player short on like I said a few bad plays. There were ALOT of phantom calls on Lebron when he clearly traveled by taking 1 or 2 extra steps, and what ever happened to the quick T's for players who express disagreement from a foul call? Lebron does this EVERYTIME which is a reason I hate him as a player. Show some respect, you aren't going to go through your entire career without getting a foul so don't act like it. I swear the players like him and Wade piss me off more than anybody because they think that they never foul and also they think there pump fakes deserve a foul whenever they shoot it.
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Chi-town23-33
post Mar 31 2007, 05:33 PM
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It was frustrating to watch that. The best game winning opportunity was when Gordon came off the screen to shoot that last three. The problem with Gordon is that he can get his own shot only when there is one defender. The moment you double team him he gets trapped. He does not possess the handles to dribble in between both and because of his height he can't see over someone like Anderson Varejao. He was put in a bad spot.

Also, it may have been crazy for him to get 4 straight opportunities but whoelse is going to take the shot. Everytime another Bulls player got the ball did they think about taking the shot themselves? The first thing they did was try to get the ball to Ben. He was our best shot and it didin't work out. Overall it is a combination of Ben not having the proper skills and the opposing defense keying into our #1 option. I think we will see many more finishes like this until we get someone who can score downlow and open up space for a Gordon GW or even a Hinrich GW.
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eddog2
post Mar 31 2007, 06:15 PM
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I think we will see many more finishes like this until we get someone who can score downlow and open up space for a Gordon GW or even a Hinrich GW.
[/quote]

Agreed. But we'll still have the occasional BG miracle.
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soxfan101
post Mar 31 2007, 06:18 PM
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The only problem i had with Ben Gordon was him constantly driving in and turning over the ball or offensive foul, and Skiles should of put an end to that it happened way too many times. I didnt mind the 3 point shot at the end because he got a good look and it would have won the game.
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AirScott
post Apr 1 2007, 05:07 PM
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yeah, we're being ridiculous, saying someone other than Gordon should have the ball in his hands for the final shot. you're right, 1-for-10 is an awesome success rate in those chances. makes sense, Deng hasn't proven himself. but neither has he gotten the chance to. he hasn't been given the ball in that kind of situation. once, maybe twice? or Hinrich "not hustling" for that loose ball, like it's easy to get it before Varejo, like Varejo isn't going to expect that ball to be loose more than Hinrich would.

I must be out of my mind to want to give the ball to Hinrich for once for the last attempt, especially after that sick crossover on Pavlovic led to the open jumper. or Deng, who has been killer with the mid-range jump shot, and put up 30 points again today. no, no, let's keep giving it to Gordon on the last possession. I'm with you.
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soxfan101
post Apr 1 2007, 10:56 PM
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Deng was pretty much off the entire day and Ben Gordon is our best shooter. Nobody is going to hit it all the time but if anyone is going to take a last shot and assuming he isn't going to be driving in I'll take Gordon over anyone else on this team.
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TeaLeafReaderII
post Apr 2 2007, 12:17 AM
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QUOTE (AirScott @ Apr 1 2007, 06:00 PM) *
or Hinrich "not hustling" for that loose ball, like it's easy to get it before Varejo, like Varejo isn't going to expect that ball to be loose more than Hinrich would.

That is a cop out. The ball was on the freaking ground right in front of him and he was looking right at it. You put Duhon in that situation and he is giving up his body, diving for that ball, and getting crushed by varejo.
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eddog2
post Apr 2 2007, 08:34 PM
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QUOTE (AirScott @ Apr 1 2007, 06:00 PM) *
yeah, we're being ridiculous, saying someone other than Gordon should have the ball in his hands for the final shot. you're right, 1-for-10 is an awesome success rate in those chances. makes sense, Deng hasn't proven himself. but neither has he gotten the chance to. he hasn't been given the ball in that kind of situation. once, maybe twice? or Hinrich "not hustling" for that loose ball, like it's easy to get it before Varejo, like Varejo isn't going to expect that ball to be loose more than Hinrich would.

I must be out of my mind to want to give the ball to Hinrich for once for the last attempt, especially after that sick crossover on Pavlovic led to the open jumper. or Deng, who has been killer with the mid-range jump shot, and put up 30 points again today. no, no, let's keep giving it to Gordon on the last possession. I'm with you.


Since when is Pavlovic an good defender? He should be able to do that more often but not only when he has a player incapable of guarding him. Anyway, Hinrich got that sissy ass runner or should I say "finger roll" blocked earlier in the 4th. Had he actually made it a runner and lofted the ball up instead of underhand it wouldn't have been blocked. That's the guy I want taking my last shot. Give me a break.

Gordon's the best clutch player on the Bulls. I'll live with him shooting whether he makes it or misses.
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