Spencer Hawes, the first one to workout with the bulls Options

[ZoomSlowik]

Why in the world are you more worried about the bench press than his scoring ability? The bench press is the most overrated exercise in the history of mankind. When is that in any way, shape, or form represented during the coarse of a basketball game. No player in the draft is going to dominate from day 1. Not Oden, not Durant, not Conley, not Hawes...no one. And no one is expecting it either.

To say Hawes is more of a project then say, a Brendan Wright, or a Joakim Noah is a joke. He has the most polished low post game and he had good size. Add to that he's only 19 and will still grow into his body and be able to bulk up, and you have a potentially dominant low post threat. With Hawes, you know exactly what you are getting.

Um, yeah, Oden and Durant are actually probably going to be damn good from day one. The rest is wide open though...

[SoxFan1]

Um, yeah, Oden and Durant are actually probably going to be damn good from day one. The rest is wide open though...

You expect them to dominate the NBA from day 1? Lebron didn't dominate. He was the last can't-miss prospect.

[Serbbojo]

Hawes is the safe choice for us and the most logical. He gives us size and something we lack, post skills.

[Balta1701-B]

Hawes is the safe choice for us and the most logical. He gives us size and something we lack, post skills.

Even if Hawes winds up not being the best player we could get at spot 9, I think it may be pretty hard for us to go wrong by getting him.

Just think about our lineup next year. It's right below me if you need it. First, add Hawes. 2nd, add in PJ Brown. 3rd, spend a couple mil on someone else with a little size, and look how we should compare to 06-07.

Thomas 07-08 >>> Thomas 06-07 if he even works at all this offseason.
Deng 07-08 > Deng 06-07 based on Lu's trend of improving each season.
Wallace 07-08 < Wallace 06-07 if Ben gradually loses a step. Hopefully he can be the same guy, maybe with fewer minutes.
Hinrich 07-08 = Hinrich 06-07 if all goes well.
Gordon 07-08 > Gordon 06-07, esp. if we develop a better inside game.
Hawes 07-08 > PJ Brown 06-07, hopefully at the very worst.
PJ Brown 07-08 + MLE player > Michael Sweetney + Malik Allen in 06-07.
Noc 07-08 > Noc 06-07, all he has to do is play the full season.
Duhon 07-08 = Duhon 06-07
Thabo 07-08 >> Thabo 06-07.

Every single spot in our lineup shoudl be improved over last year except for any additional Decline in Ben Wallace (although he won't have to spend time adapting to his new team). This is a case where it's probably ok to go with the safest choice, unless you've got a really, really good reason not to.

[eddog2]

You expect them to dominate the NBA from day 1? Lebron didn't dominate. He was the last can't-miss prospect.

Now I'm convinced that you actually know nothing. Lebron didn't dominate? Are you serious. I bet you think Kirk Hinrich dominated from day 1.

Lebron average 20.9 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 5.9 apg, & 1.6 spg. That's pretty impressive. His FG% was the only thing that was low. That's b/c he was a rookie and had to get used to the NBA. But he was by far the best player ever in his first year after jumping straight from high school.

I expect Oden and Durant to dominate from day 1. I don't expect them to be top 5 players their first year but they definately should be the cornerstone of their respective franchises in their first year. Durant might take a little bit to get adjusted b/c he's so skinny but he'll put the ball in the basket from day one. Something Spencer Hawes probably won't do.

[SoxFan1]

Now I'm convinced that you actually know nothing. Lebron didn't dominate? Are you serious. I bet you think Kirk Hinrich dominated from day 1.

Lebron average 20.9 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 5.9 apg, & 1.6 spg. That's pretty impressive. His FG% was the only thing that was low. That's b/c he was a rookie and had to get used to the NBA. But he was by far the best player ever in his first year after jumping straight from high school.

I expect Oden and Durant to dominate from day 1. I don't expect them to be top 5 players their first year but they definately should be the cornerstone of their respective franchises in their first year. Durant might take a little bit to get adjusted b/c he's so skinny but he'll put the ball in the basket from day one. Something Spencer Hawes probably won't do.

Yes, I think Hinrich should be MVP each year as well. And despite the fact that Hawes main strength is putting the ball in the basket, you refuse to believe he can do it. But...Conley is the best point guard ever.

Maybe we should start a pool on the 1st time you make a post without mentioning Hinrich?

[eddog2]

Yes, I think Hinrich should be MVP each year as well. And despite the fact that Hawes main strength is putting the ball in the basket, you refuse to believe he can do it. But...Conley is the best point guard ever.

I never said Conley was the best ever. Just said he was better at distributing the ball than Kirk. A few years ago I also predicted that Deron Williams would be a sure fire PG. But none of my friends thought so. The only thing holding Conley back is his jump shot and his size. However, he's pretty quick and athletic so his size should allow him to blow by defenders.

And yes, I do question whether or not Hawes will be effective in the NBA. I don't want another project and if we're going to take a project I definately don't want it to be a big man with athletic constraints. If we're going to take a project it needs to be someone that has tremendous physical upside.

As for Hawes, I know he's young. That's the problem. I just don't think he'll contribute in a meaningful way from day 1. I think is lack of strength and the great disparity of talent from college to the pros will be a very big wakeup call for the kid. It won't be for Oden (the man beast) but it will be for Hawes. Hawes should have played in a tougher conference and battled Oden to get the true test of what life in the NBA might/will be like.

Yes, I think Hinrich should be MVP each year as well. And despite the fact that Hawes main strength is putting the ball in the basket, you refuse to believe he can do it. But...Conley is the best point guard ever.

Maybe we should start a pool on the 1st time you make a post without mentioning Hinrich?

Hinrich. Guess I lost.

[Serbbojo]

. But...Conley is the best point guard ever.

We dont need a point guard we need a center, a CENTER!!!!!! Getting Conley improves us slightly. Getting a center who can score will improve us tremendously, even if he only gets us 10pts a game, hes still a threat and will draw coverage.

[eddog2]

We dont need a point guard we need a center, a CENTER!!!!!! Getting Conley improves us slightly. Getting a center who can score will improve us tremendously, even if he only gets us 10pts a game, hes still a threat and will draw coverage.

I agree. But Hawes won't average 10 ppg in his first or second year. You can quote me on that.

[SoxFan1]

I never said Conley was the best ever. Just said he was better at distributing the ball than Kirk. A few years ago I also predicted that Deron Williams would be a sure fire PG. But none of my friends thought so. The only thing holding Conley back is his jump shot and his size. However, he's pretty quick and athletic so his size should allow him to blow by defenders.

And yes, I do question whether or not Hawes will be effective in the NBA. I don't want another project and if we're going to take a project I definately don't want it to be a big man with athletic constraints. If we're going to take a project it needs to be someone that has tremendous physical upside.

As for Hawes, I know he's young. That's the problem. I just don't think he'll contribute in a meaningful way from day 1. I think is lack of strength and the great disparity of talent from college to the pros will be a very big wakeup call for the kid. It won't be for Oden (the man beast) but it will be for Hawes. Hawes should have played in a tougher conference and battled Oden to get the true test of what life in the NBA might/will be like.
Hinrich. Guess I lost.

I never said Hinrich dominated from day 1 either. And why do you continue to be so hard-headed? Hawes has the best low post game of anyone in the draft. That means better than Oden, Noah, Jianlian, Smith, etc. How did you feel about the drafting of Tyrus Thomas last year? He was in the same position as Hawes. 1 year in college. The difference: Thomas had the athleticism, Hawes has the game. Hawes is not a project. Get it through your brain. He has the game, he has the smarts. He's not coming into the NBA having to learn how to play. He knows that already. He's young and good. What more do you want? A 50 inch vertical and blazing speed for a 7 footer? Give me a break.

And saying he wont average 10 ppg isn't going out on much of a limb there killer. Skiles doesn't play rookies much and we know that. One thing I do know, Hawes will get taller and get stronger. That is MUCH easier than teaching someone how to put the ball in the basket, which he can clearly do well. I'll tell you this much, if he starts 60+ games for the Bulls, he will average 10ppg.

And as far as transitioning to the NBA and playing in a tougher conference, well, he could have gone to UConn or UNC and if he did, he would be a top 5 pick right now, guaranteed.

We dont need a point guard we need a center, a CENTER!!!!!! Getting Conley improves us slightly. Getting a center who can score will improve us tremendously, even if he only gets us 10pts a game, hes still a threat and will draw coverage.

I was being sarcastic.

[Serbbojo]

I was being sarcastic.

lol sorry i guess i shouldve read further back.

but yea i cant see Hawes averaging less than 10ppg for 2 years straight thats just absurd to think that a guy with his offensive skills will not be able to score for 2 years.

[eddog2]

lol sorry i guess i shouldve read further back.

but yea i cant see Hawes averaging less than 10ppg for 2 years straight thats just absurd to think that a guy with his offensive skills will not be able to score for 2 years.

It's one thing to score and another to average 10 ppg. If he goes to a team with not much help he'll probably average that b/c they'll have no other options. However, the Bulls have scoring options that will far exceed what he brings to the table. Keep thinking he's that great. We'll see how good he is next year when he's playing for a team not named the Bulls.

[eddog2]

It's one thing to score and another to average 10 ppg. If he goes to a team with not much help he'll probably average that b/c they'll have no other options. However, the Bulls have scoring options that will far exceed what he brings to the table. Keep thinking he's that great. We'll see how good he is next year when he's playing for a team not named the Bulls.

Who he should be compared to is Chris Kaman from a few years ago. I like Kaman but even he hasn't lived up the the hype yet. He's a good player and would be a great fit on the Bulls but even after being drafted #6 overall and putting up better numbers in terms of weight/strength/& speed then Hawes, he didn't even average 10 ppg until his 3rd season. And that was after 3 years of college at Central Michigan compared to the young freshman. Kaman average 22.4 ppg and 12.0 rpg his junior year. Not to mention that great shot blocking ability.

[SoxFan1]

Who he should be compared to is Chris Kaman from a few years ago. I like Kaman but even he hasn't lived up the the hype yet. He's a good player and would be a great fit on the Bulls but even after being drafted #6 overall and putting up better numbers in terms of weight/strength/& speed then Hawes, he didn't even average 10 ppg until his 3rd season. And that was after 3 years of college at Central Michigan compared to the young freshman. Kaman average 22.4 ppg and 12.0 rpg his junior year. Not to mention that great shot blocking ability.

So I guess Hawes shot-blocking records at WU don't mean much?

Hawes owns the freshman record for blocked shots with 54, surpassing the previous standard of 32 set by Todd MacCulloch in 1996 ... The 54 blocks placed Hawes fourth among UW's all-time single-season leaders, behind the 67 of both David Dixon (2002) and Chris Welp (1986) and the 63 of Welp (1987) ... Ranked third among Pac-10 players with 54 blocked shots ... Honored as the Dec. 26 Pac-10 Player of the Week after leading UW to an 88-72 upset of 12th-ranked LSU ... Helped defend LSU star Glen Davis, putting and end to "Big Baby's" 48-game double-figure scoring streak ... Registered three double-doubles, with 23 points and 12 rebounds against LSU (Dec. 20), 12 points and 12 rebounds at Pittsburgh (Feb. 17) and 13 points and 15 boards against UCLA (Mar. 3)

[dasox24]

I wish I could've been around today for the development of this thread, but I will say that I'm a firm believer that Hawes is very capable of averaging at least 10 pts/game by his 2nd season. He's too polished offensively not to. And those of you who have strength concerns about Hawes, I think you'll change your mind after he's had a year in a NBA workout routine.